Potato = Startover?

[amywhole30s]

It's my birthday on Sunday, and I'm on day 11 (Sunday will be day 13). 

 

I read in some of the forums why potatoes aren't allowed, because they're not the best nutrient wise, and because of the psychological side to what potatoes usually become (fries, mashed potatoes, etc).

 

On Sunday my boyfriend wants to take me out for dinner - and one of our favourite places has a blackened fish with veggies and it's served with rice. In the past I usually ask for their roasted potatoes instead of rice.

 

Now, yes, I can just ask for more veggies, but since it's my birthday I'm starting up a little pity party for allowing myself the potatoes...

 

But, would eating one serving of roasted potatoes mean I need to start over? Or is it one of those things that technically not bad, but also not encouraged? I don't plan on eating them the rest of the Whole 30, we actually only buy potatoes when my parents are coming for dinner. I won't eat them if it'll cause issues that put me back at day 1.

[Guest Andria]

Personally, I don't understand nor agree with the no potato rule. I don't see how mashed sweet potato or fries are any different. I can leave potato chips, so there is no issue with that. I have considered doing a Whole30 with potatoes (potatoes are full of great nutrients: protein, magnesium, potassium! Who said they are nutrient poor???) occassionally for variety and I enjoy the flavor.

With that said, due to the rules, to be a Whole30 you can't have potatoes....just get the extra veggies :-)

[GFChris]

Technically, if you had the potatoes, it would at a minimum merit delaying reintro of potatoes for 30 days.

 

I would be more concerned about whether the potatoes are cooked in something non-compliant. For example, are they cooked in butter or a non-compliant oil? Are they coated in something containing gluten?

 

I'd also be wary of whether the coatings on the blackened fish were compliant.

 

If it were me, I'd go for a dry grilled steak with only salt and pepper, and a double order of steamed veggies. Bring along compliant dressing to use on your salad.

[Tom Denham]

The Whole30 is not open to customization. It isn't defined by the consensus of participants on the forum or by the moderators. It is defined by Dallas and Melissa Hartwig. Thousands of people have committed themselves to following the plan for 30 days. If you decide that you are going to eat roasted potatoes on day 13, knowing that they are not part of the plan, you will no longer be a committed member of the community. You would become a visitor who has decided that your judgement is superior to everyone else who did a Whole30 whether they liked all the details or not. I hope you decide to stay a full member of the community. 

 

By the way, I don't like all the rulings the Hartwig's have made, but it is not my program. 

 

Further more, when I originally started my Whole30 in May of 2010, I forgot white potatoes were off plan and ate boiled potatoes with green beans twice before I re-read the guidelines and recognized my mistake. I stopped eating potatoes for the next 2 years, not because I think there is anything bad about white potatoes, but because I wanted to be a full-participating member of the community. In my opinion, it is one thing to make a mistake and eat white potatoes because you didn't remember they were off plan. It is totally different when you say, I can do it my way regardless of what the guidelines say. 

[missmary]

Ha. full confession: I come to this conversation after having new potatoes with roasted chicken thigh (and green beans and cherry tomatoes) for lunch. I still feel I am a member of this community. What I don't feel is that I am doing a whole30 at the moment. I am not. I have moved forward after my whole30 and make informed choices about what I eat and don't eat. Potatoes are part of what I eat (although fairly rare).

 

Part of what is wonderful about the whole30 is that there are very specific rules to follow for a discrete period of time. It works for lots of people, and the Hartwigs have decided that enough of those people will see more success eliminating potatoes, so they made that rule. For 30 days they ask you to follow the rules. All of them, not just the ones that you like  it's AFTER the 30 days that you start to figure out which of the rules might bend for your specific context, because it isn't until AFTER the 30 days that you have the perspective you need to be able to make those decisions. make sense?

 

It's very easy to order fish with double veggies and no potatoes. do that.

 

EDIT: and happy birthday!!

[WunderHase]

First of all, to the original post: happy birthday, and this would be a great opportunity for you to override a habit of rewarding oneself with food. There are more valuable presents to give oneself (than a potato) and one is to realize that you have the power over food, not the other way around. Each time you make such a decision, it puts a crack in the old patterns and reinforces your own empowerment.

 

Secondly: Wow. Shunned by a whole community for making a judgment call regarding one's own body? With all due respect, that's cult-talk, and I don't understand why these specific diets always turn into those.

 

I can be totally honest about the fact that since I didn't follow the three meals per day rule, I can not say that I've done Whole30. I didn't do it. I ate whole foods and apart from couple of mistakes I stayed compliant, but I still didn't do Whole30. That's why I haven't written about any success story, even if I did lose a bunch of weight and inches and lost all cravings. It would not be right. I also wrote a disclaimer in my blog pointing out that even though it says "Whole30 documentation" in the title, my meal frequency and amount was not what Whole30 is supposed to look like and that I failed to follow it.

 

I was going to try it later again for couple of weeks at least. However, now I'm just completely turned off by this whole thing, and quite honestly don't even want to be a visitor in such a community. So, I wish you all the best. This kind of thing is just not for me.

[missmary]

Secondly: Wow. Shunned by a whole community for making a judgment call regarding one's own body? With all due respect, that's cult-talk, and I don't understand why these specific diets always turn into those.

 

Really? I hope you don't see my post that way, as I certainly wasn't shunning the op (and I don't think Tom meant to either). I think sometimes it can be hard to read tone with text written on the internet. You (and everyone else) are a welcome part of the community even if your whole30 wasn't perfect. Nobody does this perfectly, especially the first time. There is just a big difference between making a few mistakes and picking and choosing which rules to follow. Everyone is free to design their own way of eating, whatever that may be, but if you want to do a whole30, then...well...do a whole30  that lack of a grey area is what makes it good for some people (and makes other people want to pull their hair out and rebel) both types of people are good.

[Physibeth]

I don't think it is shunning from the community. I think the point is the Whole30 program is a trademarked program with defined rules so saying "I did a Whole30" should mean something. Making a mistake and making a conscience decision are to different things. If I finished a half marathon but accidentally/unknowingly cut part of the mileage out because the course was poorly marked I would still feel ok saying I did a half marathon, but if I decided to get in someones car for a mile of the course and then finish I would not feel ok saying a did a half marathon.

[amywhole30s]

Thanks for your responses and birthday wishes.

 

I'm actually kind of surprised by the fact that I wouldn't be considered a member of the community for one decision, as I have read in posts in the past that many paleo still eat potatoes. I asked because potatoes are very different than asking if I can eat a loaf of bread. There's a line somewhere... and the reasons for not eating banana-egg pancakes and potatoes are different from gluten and sulphites. 

 

I do know that they are gluten-free as I have been gluten-free for over a year and a half. I will likely get the vegetables instead. 

 

I don't eat red meat, so ordering a steak isn't an option for me. 

[Robin Strathdee]

 

I'm actually kind of surprised by the fact that I wouldn't be considered a member of the community for one decision, as I have read in posts in the past that many paleo still eat potatoes. I asked because potatoes are very different than asking if I can eat a loaf of bread. There's a line somewhere... and the reasons for not eating banana-egg pancakes and potatoes are different from gluten and sulphites. 

 

 

Hi amywhole30s!

 

Another happy birthday to add to the list!  

Please don't take the above comments to mean that you wouldn't be welcome here on the forum, or in the Whole9 community, over a few potatoes. That's absolutely not the case.  I think the point that Tom was making is that if you choose to eat something off-plan (rather than an honest mistake), you are choosing to drop the qualifier "whole30" from your 30 days.  

 

Around here, we don't like to assign value to food choices (good vs bad), so it would simply be your choice to Whole30 or not. Again, you'd be welcome here no matter what you chose, but there is a level of community between those who are working hard to do the program completely and an aspect of that would be lost. 

[Roz Griffiths]

From ISWF -

...the only way this program will work is if you give it the full thirty days - no cheats, slips, or special-occasion foods or drinks. This isn't us playing tough, or trying to make the Whole30 "hardcore". The thirty-day no-cheat policy is based on science & our experience (p.203)

[aventurine]

I was at a (crappy) catered dinner last night. I was supposed to get fish and veggies (I'm pescetarian, so I couldn't eat the meat). They forgot my special meal (and I had been very clear in what I requested), and the veggies they had with the regular meals were roast baby potatoes and mix of....corn and peas! Because it was prepped off-site in advance, there was no option to request anything other than what was there. The cucumber and tomato salad they served was just not enough for me, and I definitely wasn't going to eat the bread!  The least-bad option in the situation seemed to be the potatoes, so I had enough to get by until I could get home and eat something. 

 

Do I have to start over? I'm really frustrated, because I made it all the way to Day 19...

[AdriannaJean]

The Whole30 is not open to customization. It isn't defined by the consensus of participants on the forum or by the moderators. It is defined by Dallas and Melissa Hartwig. Thousands of people have committed themselves to following the plan for 30 days. If you decide that you are going to eat roasted potatoes on day 13, knowing that they are not part of the plan, you will no longer be a committed member of the community. You would become a visitor who has decided that your judgement is superior to everyone else who did a Whole30 whether they liked all the details or not. I hope you decide to stay a full member of the community. 

 

By the way, I don't like all the rulings the Hartwig's have made, but it is not my program. 

 

Further more, when I originally started my Whole30 in May of 2010, I forgot white potatoes were off plan and ate boiled potatoes with green beans twice before I re-read the guidelines and recognized my mistake. I stopped eating potatoes for the next 2 years, not because I think there is anything bad about white potatoes, but because I wanted to be a full-participating member of the community. In my opinion, it is one thing to make a mistake and eat white potatoes because you didn't remember they were off plan. It is totally different when you say, I can do it my way regardless of what the guidelines say. 

This came off as pretty rude. Answering a simple, "yes it would constitute a start-over" would have sufficed.

[praxisproject]

Since it's your birthday, call ahead with your Whole30 list and let them know it's your special birthday dinner, see if they can make you something extra special in the veggie department, that way you get a special birthday dinner and don't have to eat the potatoes or rice. I have found most restaurants to be accommodating with advance notice, some will have to buy extras at the market (maybe they could get you some sweet potato or pumpkin).

It's totally your choice (your food always is) but if you're still thinking it over, in 6 months time you may wish you didn't have the white potatoes, as a whole30 is a lot of effort and skipping one thing may be something you come to regret, which isn't fun when it's something you do on a special day. it's hard to tell this early on, before you've finished. There's usually a birthday or something special in any 30 day period (not always YOUR birthday! Happy Birthday! )

 

For anyone reading this who is new to the no-white-potatoes thing, there is one additional big difference than just nutrients for sweet potatoes and white potatoes:

 

White potato = nightshade

Sweet potato = NOT a nightshade

 

PS. Tom is really nice and has helped me with lots of food questions since I joined the forum.

[Roz Griffiths]

I was at a (crappy) catered dinner last night. I was supposed to get firsh and veggies (I'm pescetarian, so I couldn't eat the meat). They forgot my special meal (and I had been very clear in what I requested), and the veggies they had with the regular meals were roast baby potatoes and mix of....corn and peas! Because it was prepped off-site in advance, there was no option to request anything other than what was there. The cucumber and tomato salad they served was just not enough for me, and I definitely wasn't going to eat the bread! The least-bad option in the situation seemed to be the potatoes, so I had enough to get by until I could get home and eat something.

Do I have to start over? I'm really frustrated, because I made it all the way to Day 19...

This sounds like one of those "no choice" situations. You might need a moderator for the official line, but personally, if it was me, i'd take careful notice of any reaction that may have come from the potatoes & maybe add a few days onto the end if i felt it was needed. On the healthy>less healthy scale, potatoes were certainly a better option than the bread! Your post reminded me of a works Christmas do many years ago when i was a vegetarian; 30-odd people round a table, 2 servers, & my meal came out about 15 minutes after the first ones (who were now looking for pudding ). I can't imagine how p*ssed off i would have been if it hadn't come at all!

[Roz Griffiths]

This came off as pretty rude. Answering a simple, "yes it would constitute a start-over" would have sufficed.

It seems rude out of context, but the thread sort of goes

Does it matter if i have potatoes?

I can't see the problem with them

They would merit a restart, order something else

...and THEN Tom simply provides more detailed reasons why the plan can't be adjusted. There are clear explanations in ISWF as to why the whole30 is how it is, why it's 30 days & why it's so rigid. White potatoes can actually be very problematic for many people. Just because current Paleo thinking is leaning towards them being "basically ok" doesn't change the fact that they're a nightshade, & if you have AI problems they're really not "basically ok"

[amywhole30s]

Yikes, I can't believe how much of a debate this turned into!

 

I actually ended up telling my boyfriend it wasn't worth going out for dinner and asked if we could make dinner at home, which we did. 

 

I'm not going to lie though, asking a simple question seemed to get out of hand pretty quickly and this did turn me off from the program quite a bit. 

 

This program isn't black and white. There are a lot of 'technically's' in there, and I've seen many people that have asked about eating one thing by accident and whether it meant you had to start over, sometimes it did, sometimes it didn't.  

 

I get the making a simple mistake versus a conscious decision. Which is why I opened up the conversation to this BEFORE I ate potatoes. 

 

This came off as pretty rude. Answering a simple, "yes it would constitute a start-over" would have sufficed.

 

I tend to agree with AdriannaJean though. 

 

Also... I get that potatoes are nightshades... and as my original post stated I RARELY eat white potatoes, because we simply prefer sweet potatoes. However, arguing that because they're nightshades... is not a black and white answer either since there are other nightshades that are allowed in the Whole 30. 

 

After doing some investigating, in the pinned 'Before you ask Can I have?" there is a member that had asked about baked potatoes back in 2012, and they were told to start a forum. http://forum.whole9life.com/topic/8-before-you-ask-can-i-have/ I couldn't figure out how to find the forum she started, but I looked again today.

 

This her forum: http://forum.whole9life.com/topic/2538-baked-potato/ 

 

 

White potatoes are not harmful, but you can do better.

People think of white potatoes as a meaningful vegetable when their nutrient density is rather low. And Americans eat more potatoes than anything else. Dallas and Melissa banned white potatoes from the Whole30 as a corrective. Instead of adding more pounds of potatoes to your annual diet, eat something different, something more nutrient dense.

The people who are most successful doing a Whole30 add lots of new things to their diet. I made a plan to eat every vegetable I found in the grocery store. I have not made it to radicchio yet, but I will.

I use turnips in place of potatoes when potatoes are the traditional choice. Turnip salad is actually quite good and turnips are much more nutrient dense.

 

 

I do want to note that Tom you seem to have changed your answer/tone towards potatoes quite significantly. 

[SarahEM]

Happy Brithday Amy!

 

How did everything turn out?

[SarahEM]

Sorry I posted my comment right as you posted yours.

 

Hopefully the dinner at home was just as nice!

[amywhole30s]

Sorry I posted my comment right as you posted yours.

 

Hopefully the dinner at home was just as nice!

 

Thank you!! It was very good, we made lobster tail and a big salad! and then we decided to go to the movies after dinner!

[amysue7]

This came off as pretty rude. Answering a simple, "yes it would constitute a start-over" would have sufficed.

I agree with AdriannaJean. The response came off as harsh and could've been worded in a way that offers support and guidance. Those are the reasons people participate in the forum.

[cmccoy]

I was at a (crappy) catered dinner last night. I was supposed to get fish and veggies (I'm pescetarian, so I couldn't eat the meat). They forgot my special meal (and I had been very clear in what I requested), and the veggies they had with the regular meals were roast baby potatoes and mix of....corn and peas! Because it was prepped off-site in advance, there was no option to request anything other than what was there. The cucumber and tomato salad they served was just not enough for me, and I definitely wasn't going to eat the bread!  The least-bad option in the situation seemed to be the potatoes, so I had enough to get by until I could get home and eat something. 

 

Do I have to start over? I'm really frustrated, because I made it all the way to Day 19...

I totally understand!  I had to go to my husbands work dinner on Saturday night that was catered.  The salad was okay because the dressing was on the side so I just took some lemon wedges and used the juice as a dressing.  However, the dinner was totally non-compliant.  Fried chicken with potato wedges.  It was so hard but I just declined my plate, including the huge piece of cheesecake (my FAVORITE dessert by the way) so I wouldn't be tempted.  The 30 minutes of watching everyone else indulge was miserable but after that, the plates were cleared and the speaker started and I had such a feeling of accomplishment so it was well worth it. It got me thinking that had I eaten the dinner not only would I have blown my Whole 30 but instead of feeling that accomplishment, I would have felt awful -- physically and mentally. Immediate gratification is so not worth it....I'm learning that slowly every day. 

[praxisproject]

For anyone wondering about nightshades, if you have arthritis, sinus problems, unknown allergies or weird food reactions you don't understand, these are something to keep an eye on. The AIP W30 protocol would help you identify if they are an issue for you.

 

Some of them aren't obvious, like goji berries (regularly labelled a "superfood", sometimes even pictured with a cape! lol), and how you prepare them can reduce or fail to reduce the toxin-stuff in them.

[Veggie Girl]

I agree with Adrianna Jean, AmySue7, and Wunderhase that Tom's response was overly harsh and unsupportive.  Tom, I know you have a wealth of information to share, and I've very much appreciated your helpful answers to several of my posts.  It's clear how much you believe in the Whole 30 program and how much you want others to experience the same transformation that you've experienced.  I don't think you mean to be critical and judgmental, but some of your answers do come across that way.