Is it REALLY better to limit carbs?

[newwhole30er]

I've asked about this before here, but am still confused. The official recommendation is a fist-size serving a day of starchy vegetables. I've seen some moderators say this is the bare minimum and recommend increasing for a variety of reasons. The impression I got from reading the Whole30 book was that only people who are exceptionally active really need more carbs than the bare minimum, and I guess I inferred from that that if you're NOT active, more carbs than the minimum will only make you fat. Is that true?

 

Then I did see on another thread (can't remember which now) someone asked about a meal that was 1/2 meat and 1/2 sweet potato, and a moderator said that seemed like a lot of carbs at once. Which again seems to say that carbs really SHOULD be limited.

 

I think Chris Kresser says that for weight loss, you should stay under 50g of carbs a day.

 

Where does the truth lie???

[jmcbn]

First off let's be clear that ALL veg contain carbs - not just the starchy ones. All fruits contain carbs too - the difference with fruit being that they contain fructose (rather than glucose) which is processed by the liver & stored as fat.

Secondly, whilst CK is often referred to here on the forums his recommendation of  limiting carbs to 50g per day is for those counting macros which is not what we are about here. Feel free to try this after your 30 days but for now we would ask that you try & listen to what your body is telling you that you need.

The recommendation of a fist sized serving of starchy veg per day is based on the fact that we see people feel better by including at least this amount in their daily food intake. The natural seratonin/tryptophan in these foods helps with mood & anxiety levels.
 

The recommendation for people with blood sugar issues, or who lead a sedentary lifestyle, is to maybe stick to having a serving of starchy veg every other day.

If you are particularly active you will be depleting muscle glycogen stores when you train (particularly if you do high intensity/long duration) and these MUST be replaced because they cannot stabilize themselves from day to day - by NOT replacing them you start your training next day with a glycogen deficit - by taking starchy veg postWO your muscles will absorb and restore glycogen stores at a higher rate. In fact after high intensity/long endurance training sessions/events in sports nutrition circles the recommendation would be to continue ingesting starchy veg for up to 6hrs post training.

I hope this is of some help.




 

[WholeStanley]

Thanks jmcbn that was really helpful to hear - can I just ask what is the issue with starting your next day training with a glycogen deficit? Thanks

[jmcbn]

Thanks jmcbn that was really helpful to hear - can I just ask what is the issue with starting your next day training with a glycogen deficit? Thanks

You might be fine next day, but continue to deplete without restoring & eventually you'll hit the proverbial wall.

Without dietary carbs the body uses the proteins you eat to convert into amino acids for fuel, or if necessary it starts breaking down lean muscle mass instead. But it takes the body a lot longer to process protein than it does carbs, and you obviously don't want to be losing the muscle you've worked so hard to gain, hence the need for replenishment.

 

[ladyshanny]

Please also know that the amount of starchy veggie (carbs) that you need to feel emotionally and mentally best may not be the amount that you would need if you were trying to lose weight.  In a cruel twist, sometimes we have to pick which we want, quicker weight loss (less carbs) or stable mental and emotional health (more carbs).

[MeadowLily]

Less 'good' carbs can mean less hair on your head, watching it swirl down the drain.  Dialing it down for weight loss.  

Can it be sustained over a lifetime for body fat maintenance?

 

When someone cannot maintain it,  carb refeeding in large doses (someone starts eating it all back with carbs) - can look similar to T2 Diabetes, including blood sugar swings UP and down and hyperinsulinemia.

 

The changes in insulin sensitivity is caused by changes in enzyme levels involved in both fat and carbohydrate burning.  Long periods without carbs leads to a down regulation in the enzymes that are responsible for carbohydrate burning. 

 

When a lifetime binge eater reverts back to their former way of life,  binge eating a large amount of carbs - changes are seen in the liver.   I wouldn't recommend this for a binge eater who's looking for stability in every area of their life...or the diabetic. 

 

Without proper knowledge...this can lead to more consumption of carbs and more dialing it down until an individual can find themselves  in a deep hole.   Don't do it. 

[Brewer5]

I think carb tolerance is a highly individual thing -- depending on many different factors.  

 

The idea that everyone's hair is going to fall out is simply not true.

 

There are plenty of books FULL of knowledge out there about ketogenic diets -- and I have read many/most of them.  I think the key is to educate yourself first, and then experiment and decide what is best for you as an individual.

 

Then I did see on another thread (can't remember which now) someone asked about a meal that was 1/2 meat and 1/2 sweet potato, and a moderator said that seemed like a lot of carbs at once. Which again seems to say that carbs really SHOULD be limited.

 

^ For the record, I think this was kirkor -- he had misunderstood the recipe -- and he corrected himself.  He is also not a moderator.  Just a knowledgable guy who does not rely on much carbohydrate in his life.  

[SugarcubeOD]

Again, to restate what JCMBN said, investigating a ketogenic diet is something you may want to do after the Whole30 but it is not recommended for the purposes of your Whole30.  Eat vegetables of all varieties... starchy and non starchy.... don't do an experiment within an experiment....

[Brewer5]

But I am not saying to do an experiment within an experiment. I am saying the Whole 30 IS an experiment.

We've got keto folks here --> all the way to people eating starchy carbs with every meal & fruit on top of that. It's a wide range, and the answer to the question of "How much carbohydrate should I be eating?" varies widely.

As much as some would like to believe that there is a one-size-fits-all answer, that is not the case. A large part of the Whole 30 is learning to listen to what your body is telling you. I have been around here long enough to know that for SOME people, the answer is more carbs -- and for SOME people, the answer is less.

[newwhole30er]

I've already done a complete Whole30. I'm now on my 2nd and planning to stay on indefinitely until I am at a healthy weight. 

 

I don't exercise, but I do have 2 small kids and teach 3rd grade, so I'm on my feet a lot. 

 

I guess I'll start experimenting

 

I think Kresser says to only count starchy vegetables, not non-starchy ones, in your 50g total. Looked it up and seems that a fist-sized serving of sweet potato would be around 24g of carbs. So if someone didn't eat fruit (I try to avoid it) and only had the minimum fist-size serving, that'd be HALF the amount he recommends. Interesting.

[reneeruecks]

ok so after reading this I feel like I have been doing this all wrong, I'm on day 23. I eat sweet potatoes will almost every meal and then sometimes fruit after. I could not even imagine not eating them.

[ShannonM816]

ok so after reading this I feel like I have been doing this all wrong, I'm on day 23. I eat sweet potatoes will almost every meal and then sometimes fruit after. I could not even imagine not eating them.

 

Please don't weigh yourself until your Whole30 ends. That is one of the rules of the program. It is every bit as important as the rules about what not to eat. You'll notice I have edited out that part of your response, so no one coming along after this thinks that weighing is okay. Having said that, it is a reasonably healthy rate of loss. This is not a quick weight loss program. It is a program to help you get healthier.

 

If you are happy and you feel good eating sweet potato at every meal, and you're also eating a variety of other vegetables, don't worry about it too much. Now, if you're eating sweet potato and not eating a variety of other vegetables, then you may need to cut back on them to get in other things, because a variety of vegetables will get you a variety of vitamins and minerals, and variety is good.