No tangible differences

[Loricious]

This is my second round of Whole30.  Currently on Day 8.  And I've felt zero changes.

Why don't I ever feel any different on this Whole30 kick? I'm not angry about it, but so many people find this time of the program to be grueling, experiencing withdrawals, major digestion changes, etc...

I seriously have not gone through that. Not before, and not now. Am I tired? Well, yes, but I'm always tired. But no noticeable changes. So what does that mean? My gut is healed or too far gone? That my chronic fatigue is something more deep seeded that can't be cured with fixing my diet?

What gives?

[ladyshanny]

Sorry, you WANT it to be grueling with major withdrawals and digestive issues? LOL, probably not.

It's different for everyone. How awful the first few days are usually are directly related to what you used to eat previously. If a person was a pastry washed with a coke for breakfast, bagel and fries with a sundae for lunch and pizza, beer and halloween candy for dinner then ya, it's going to be a major change.

If you ate fairly clean and are currently feeling no nasty side effects, rejoice! But not too loudly because you never know, it could still be waitin gto hit.

And please don't forget what you have alluded to. It only STARTS with food. Having a Whole30 based diet on the regular never hurt anyone...........but it won't cure everything. Sorry.  

[Loricious]

BWAH!  No! I don't want to feel like crud, but I'd also like for it to feel like it's working, you know?  I was hoping to find others who went through the same thing... namely nothing.   

 

In the meantime, I shall rejoice!  But quietly.  

[Jessintherain]

You're not alone! I'm day 10 (first w30), and I feel pretty normal. I think it's important to remember that you're still less than 1/3 of the way through, and if you already had a pretty healthy diet, the changes might be more subtle. I bet (and hope this is true for me as well!) that you'll have some changes by the end, and really feel the impact during reintroduction.

Rejoice on!

[thehappiest]

On 1/9/2017 at 10:25 AM, Loricious said:

This is my second round of Whole30.  Currently on Day 8.  And I've felt zero changes.

Why don't I ever feel any different on this Whole30 kick? I'm not angry about it, but so many people find this time of the program to be grueling, experiencing withdrawals, major digestion changes, etc...

I seriously have not gone through that. Not before, and not now. Am I tired? Well, yes, but I'm always tired. But no noticeable changes. So what does that mean? My gut is healed or too far gone? That my chronic fatigue is something more deep seeded that can't be cured with fixing my diet?

What gives?

I'm with you!  I'm 14 days into my first round and I have felt almost normal the whole time.  (The only changes have been 1) bloating because I overdid it on nut butter and 2) irritated feelings when my co-workers had pizza and cake in front of me, LOL.)

I'm glad to hear that I'm not alone!  It makes it harder to stick with it when I feel like nothing is happening...but I'm going to stick it out so I can check for food sensitivities during the reintroduction phase, as well as practicing self-discipline and mindfulness.

[Guest]

I haven't had any severe mood changes, I didn't go through the withdrawal symptoms described in the first few days. I haven't had any major cravings.  Having said all that - at 15 days in I am noticing some NSV's, although better sleep isn't one of them. For the most part I'd say I haven't experienced some of the extremes I was expecting, but I do feel and am starting to look better overall.

[MCM777]

This is also my first W30. I'm on day 16, and don't notice much, if any, difference. The first week I experienced insomnia, then the second week I was narcoleptic! This week I feel pretty normal. I've had those insane cheating dreams, where I'm eating a huge bag of M&Ms or a whole package of Oreos. Those are pretty funny once I get over the fact that it was just a dream.

I keep thinking I'm doing something wrong because I was a TERRIBLE eater before this, but I had zero withdrawals. It is comforting to read about others' experience on this forum. It has helped a lot.

[Loricious]

Thanks for the responses!   It does help to know I'm not alone.

[LauraB1216]

My mom and I are doing our first W30 together.  She has experienced NO changes, not feeling better, worse, nothing.  She's a little frustrated.  I have seen some differences, but nothing like most people describe. :-/

 

[jmcbn]

7 minutes ago, LauraB1216 said:

My mom and I are doing our first W30 together.  She has experienced NO changes, not feeling better, worse, nothing.  She's a little frustrated.  I have seen some differences, but nothing like most people describe. :-/

 

Your mum and you didn't come into this from the same starting point though. She is your mum. You are you. You can't really both expect to have the same symptoms. Bear in mind that age, sleep, stress levels, movement/exercise, pre-existing medical conditions, former diet etc will all have a bearing on how the individual feels....

If you or your mum would like to check that you're on the right track please feel free to post a few days worth of your food/liquid intake, along with any relevant info on sleep, activity levels, medications etc.

Hope this helps.

[creativenikki]

Count me in as another noticing no differences.  It is really disappointing.  I can't think of a single NSV, and worst yet, I'm gaining weight.  Talk about a depressing experience.  

[laura_juggles]

8 minutes ago, creativenikki said:

Count me in as another noticing no differences.  It is really disappointing.  I can't think of a single NSV, and worst yet, I'm gaining weight.  Talk about a depressing experience.  

How do you know you're gaining weight? What are you eating (with portions) and are you getting enough water? What were you hoping to accomplish as a part of your Whole30? There might be something that needs tweaked in order to get you on the upswing.

[creativenikki]

1 hour ago, laura_juggles said:

How do you know you're gaining weight? What are you eating (with portions) and are you getting enough water? What were you hoping to accomplish as a part of your Whole30? There might be something that needs tweaked in order to get you on the upswing.

I know I'm gaining weight because I'm going to Weight Watchers and a personal trainer and both weigh me weekly.  I know you shouldn't weigh yourself (blah, blah, blah), but I am doing this 100% to lose weight.  That's what I want.  It's honestly all I want. I am obese, I have a lot of weight to lose.  Losing weight should happen with a diet this clean and working out with a trainer and walking daily.  Some NSVs would be great, too, but so far I haven't had anything happen.  My first Whole 30 was much better.   

My diet is pretty much the same everyday:

Breakfast - Breakfast Hash (From the whole 30 email sent out on Monday - the recipe made 4 servings)
Lunch - Chicken Salad, about 2 cups (chicken, onion, cilantro, avocado and a little mayo)
Snack - 2 to 10 olives - I often go 7 hours between lunch and dinner just because of my schedule, my meals are big enough to keep me full for quite awhile.  
Dinner - Chicken/Fish/Steak with roasted vegetables (6 oz of meat, 2 to 3 cups of roasted vegetables, cooked with olive/coconut oil)

I drink about 60 ounces of water, 20 ounces of decaf coffee and 15-20 ounces of tea each day.  Sometimes I'll have a couple strawberries within 30 minutes of dinner if I'm not totally satisfied.  The only other thing I'll eat is a few bites of whatever my daughter is eating because she has this obsession with feeding me lately.  But, she eats whole 30 compliant, so it would be like a 1/2" thick slice of banana total or 3 raisins or something.  It's not a lot.  

I haven't been having pre or post workout snacks, but I haven't been working out long, either (only 3 sessions with the trainer so far).  I might try and add those tomorrow, if I have time to make something tonight.

[laura_juggles]

Alright...this is going to suck as an answer: Whole30 isn't a weight loss diet. 

I don't get the Whole30 emails, so I don't know what was all in the hash, but you honestly might not be eating enough. Even while trying to lose weight, bigger people need more food. I'm not seeing much veg in your lunch and even if you haven't been working out for a long time, you still should have at least a post workout snack. Just a couple bites of something. Might need more water too; adding everything together, you're getting enough water and/or water-based beverages for someone ~200lbs. 

Then there's a possibility of stress...you said your first Whole30 was better. What was different in your life then? 

[jmcbn]

2 minutes ago, laura_juggles said:

Then there's a possibility of stress

Ding ding!

See my response from yesterday below:

Focusing on weight loss is a stressor. Not sleeping is a stressor (not sure if this is an issue for you). Trying to combine Whole30 & WW is an uphill battle - yep, another stressor. How often are you training on top of the two sessions with your PT each week? Cos if you're over training that's also a stressor. Stress keeps cortisol levels sky high. High cortisol results in excess body fat. See where I'm going here....?

[creativenikki]

27 minutes ago, laura_juggles said:

Alright...this is going to suck as an answer: Whole30 isn't a weight loss diet. 

I don't get the Whole30 emails, so I don't know what was all in the hash, but you honestly might not be eating enough. Even while trying to lose weight, bigger people need more food. I'm not seeing much veg in your lunch and even if you haven't been working out for a long time, you still should have at least a post workout snack. Just a couple bites of something. Might need more water too; adding everything together, you're getting enough water and/or water-based beverages for someone ~200lbs. 

Then there's a possibility of stress...you said your first Whole30 was better. What was different in your life then? 

Yes, stress is an issue.  My life is completely different from my first Whole 30.  The first time I worked at a bank, I had no kids and my life was just overall pretty easy.  Now I have a 15 month old.  I bought a business in August 2016 so now I have a lot of stress relating to that (14 employees, tons of expenses, many customers to manage, etc.).  Life is very stressful, but what can I reasonably do about that to get my weight loss going?  I started working out so I could try to combat stress, but that's not working.  I'm trying to read and drink tea at night to unwind, but I guess that isn't enough either.  I guess I can try meditation, but that just seems like it is going to be a waste of time; I really cannot imagine getting into it. 

I'm 5'6" and 189.5 pounds.  It sucks.  

The hash I made had 4 sausage links (think about the size of a bratwurst), 1 green pepper, 1 red pepper, 1 onion and 3 medium potatoes, and that made 4 servings.  

So, this is a genuine question.  If I'm not going to lose weight on Whole 30, what should I do?  I read so many stories about people losing weight on paleo or whole 30 type diets.  I need to lose weight.  What should I do?  Health is important, which is why I'm not eating the chemical food compounds that weight watchers pushes, but I honestly just don't know what to do.  

[creativenikki]

30 minutes ago, jmcbn said:

Ding ding!

See my response from yesterday below:

Focusing on weight loss is a stressor. Not sleeping is a stressor (not sure if this is an issue for you). Trying to combine Whole30 & WW is an uphill battle - yep, another stressor. How often are you training on top of the two sessions with your PT each week? Cos if you're over training that's also a stressor. Stress keeps cortisol levels sky high. High cortisol results in excess body fat. See where I'm going here....?

I know you are probably right, but it's just a very hard pill to swallow.  I mean, if my life/stress means I cannot lose weight then what do I do?  Accept that I'm going to be obese until my daughter grows up and/or I sell my business?  That sucks!  

I did make a conscious effort to relax last night, for whatever that's worth.  I'm very impatient.  I was sick with a cold about a month ago and lost 5 pounds in a week.  I gained them all back, of course, but clearly my body CAN let go of weight under some conditions.  Why won't it now?  It's depressing that I've been going to WW for almost 2 months and I'm still heavier than I was on day one.  It makes all my effort feel wasted and Whole 30 takes a lot of effort for me to plan/prepare everything. 

[laura_juggles]

Truthfully, the first thing I'd do is leave WW. 

That's an extra stressor that you don't need in your life on top of everything else. 

Are you enjoying the exercise that you're doing? If your gym offers group fitness classes, try them all until you find something that you enjoy and stick with it. Might be a dance cardio class, might be a weightlifting class, who knows? I fell in love with weightlifting because of group fitness classes and it's made me stronger (and happier) than I ever thought I could be while exercising. Are you and your trainer communicating about what you liked and didn't like about each session? Yes, you'll need to push yourself to get better/faster/stronger/etc at the gym, but it shouldn't be a slog through of time on the treadmill where you would rather be literally anywhere but there. 

Just focus on making healthy meals for yourself and your daughter. Protein, a bunch of veggies, and don't skip out on healthy fats. Maybe that means keeping a really strict Whole30 and maybe it's not, especially because the only thing you're trying to get out of this is losing weight. 

But whatever adjustments can be made to make your life less stressful are only going to benefit you in the long run. 

[creativenikki]

9 minutes ago, laura_juggles said:

Truthfully, the first thing I'd do is leave WW. 

That's an extra stressor that you don't need in your life on top of everything else. 

Are you enjoying the exercise that you're doing? If your gym offers group fitness classes, try them all until you find something that you enjoy and stick with it. Might be a dance cardio class, might be a weightlifting class, who knows? I fell in love with weightlifting because of group fitness classes and it's made me stronger (and happier) than I ever thought I could be while exercising. Are you and your trainer communicating about what you liked and didn't like about each session? Yes, you'll need to push yourself to get better/faster/stronger/etc at the gym, but it shouldn't be a slog through of time on the treadmill where you would rather be literally anywhere but there. 

Just focus on making healthy meals for yourself and your daughter. Protein, a bunch of veggies, and don't skip out on healthy fats. Maybe that means keeping a really strict Whole30 and maybe it's not, especially because the only thing you're trying to get out of this is losing weight. 

But whatever adjustments can be made to make your life less stressful are only going to benefit you in the long run. 

I probably will stop WW when my three months are up.  I actually enjoy the meetings, but I feel awful weighing in each week because I'm not losing weight at all.  Meanwhile people in the meeting talk about how they "saved their points" for some wine and got to have wine and still lost 2 pounds this week (and a million similar stories).  And then there's me... no sugar, artificial sweeteners, alcohol, etc. and I GAIN a pound?  

Edited to add: Following Whole 30 there's no way to "save" WW points for anything.  All of my points are used for meat and fat.  That's that.  I don't feel like I am overeating at all, but WW really penalizes fats still, so there's no way around using all my points on Whole 30.  Which, whatever, there really isn't anything more I need to be eating, but I'd love to find a way to eat Whole 30 while losing weight. 

I pre-paid for 56 sessions with this trainer.  I honestly hate going so far, but I've been attributing that to being out of shape.  Regardless, I'm locked into this now.  It's not a regular gym, the only time I can go there is when I'm working with the trainer.  He knows my goal is strength training, so that's what we're working on.  I picked the gym because it's in the same building as my business, so it is relatively convenient.  

[MeadowLily]

There's a big push out there to jump on every dieting bandwagon. We are blasted with commericals because of New Year's. 

The trainer, the gym, the Shock and Awe approach to everything. It's brutally strict right out the chute. I've done all of that and it's not for me.

It was never for me but worked against me and my personality. Doing what I'd always done would always get me what I'd always gotten.  Rebound weight gain and misery.

I'm very familiar with the ww/legacy lifer everything. I'm familiar with WLS, the sleeve, the bypass and every diet under the sun in my family. Familial.

I know good fats are penalized on the ww.  I know. 

You cannot combine the two programs. They're cross-grain, at cross-purposes with one another. Drinking smoothies and canned protein drinks with artificial sweetners, ordering cardboard dinners delivered to the doorstep...ditto.  It is dieting no matter how you slice it.

Throw all of it out with the bathwater.  Wash dieting down the drain when you take a shower.  Clean the slate and clear the decks. 

It may take many showers before it's literally gone out of your life.  More than 30 showers, maybe 300 or more. 

If I had every dollar back that I've thrown away on trainers and gym memberships and diets....I'd take another trip around the world.  Find movement that you enjoy and do all of it on your own terms.  Your terms. 

It's not sustainable now, it won't be 5 years from now. Think waaay down the road into your future.  Go back to the well.  Start with the template and after 30 days, create a plan that works for you.  

It may look alot like the template with extra things that you enjoy and won't trigger rebound weight gain. 

 

[jmcbn]

There's a reason why they offer a lifetime membership at WW - it doesn't work. There have been literally hundreds of women who have come through these forums having lost weight on WW & gained it ALL back (& then some) on the rebound. You cannot expect that once you return to your former ways that the weight will stay off, and the whole saving points thing? It teaches nothing about building good habits. It changes nothing. And look at the stress that the weekly weigh in is causing you - the negative emotions you're feeling from that experience alone (& the build up to it) are enough to keep those cortisol levels SKY high.

Eating wholesome, nutritious food is never going to be bad for you. However, I think you need to accept the fact that weightloss MAY happen as a side effect, but that it isn't going to happen in 30 days. You didn't get to where you are now in 30 days so it's unrealistic to expect the reverse.

Settle down into it. Build strong healthy habits. Find your own long term eating plan because in the same way that WW offer life membership W30 is not meant to be for life. Priortise sleep & re-energising as best you can. Try to find some small ways of de-stressing (like the 10  meditation I mentioned yesterday - you'd be surprised at how much this will help you unwind, or colouring in - which you could do with your daughter), and keep up the healthy movement but speak your mind to your trainer - YOU'RE paying HIM so he's got to be doing stuff that you enjoy or you'll resent every dollar you've spent, and you'll hate every moment that you're there - and that will only add to the stress.

Get yourself settled into a routine - sleeping, training, working, resting, re-energising, food-prepping, spending time with your daughter, spending time outdoors (I'm not sure where you are but if you have long winters perhaps you'd see benefit from a Vitamin D3 supplement & also Omega 3), and all the while eating well - and in time I honestly believe that your hormones will setlle, your body will find it's happy place, and you will start to see progress.

This is a marathon, not a sprint.

[MeadowLily]

The W30 approach = Body. Mind. Spirit.

The side effect of dieting rarely translates into finding  true stability with weight.  Stability with weight is one reflection of everything that's going on in your life.

But stepping off the dieting gerbil wheel is one way to make order out of that chaos. It's taken me 3 years to make it here.

[creativenikki]

@MeadowLily @jmcbn I know you guys are right about WW.  I don't really believe in their program, not at all.  I do enjoy the meetings though.  That probably sounds weird, but I like a lot of the women there.  I guess because they know how frustrating losing weight is and can relate to me/my struggles in a way that no one else in real life can.  No one in my family is overweight.  I don't have any overweight friends.  It really and truly is just me.  It's very hard to be around people constantly who can seemingly eat and do whatever they want without weight as a consequence.  Logically I realize that there are other consequences for them that just aren't visible, but damn, it is so easy to forget that when it's time to get dressed for an event or time to go shopping.  So, I'll miss the comeraderie of the meetings.  The rest of it, whatever.  

I do need a new routine, which is one NSV that this Whole 30 might give me.  I know I'm sort of floundering lately.  What is super frustrating is that I literally did gain about 15 pounds in 2 months.  Yet, it will take me a year to lose them, if I ever even do.  I was doing well weight wise after I had my DD.  I lost weight during pregnancy and 10 days post-partum I was 175.  Now I'm closing in on 190.  That happened very quickly after I returned to work last February.  I've been struggling since then to get things under control.  

[Loricious]

Hey now, *I* believe in that program.  It's lifetime because it's meant to be a lifestyle change, not a one trick pony.  They offer lifetime because they want to continue to encourage maintenance, a reminder that what you learn and how you eat is not just for the loss but for life.  

 

C'mon now.  Don't start bashing another program.  After my 30 day stint here is done, I'm going back to that program.  The two are not compatible.  WW is now all about low sugar, sure, but high saturated fat = high points.  They love lean protein and veggies and fruits. 

 

This Whole30 is an elimination diet, a process where you figure out what triggers bloating, inflammation.  You may lose weight, you may not.  That isn't the point of Whole30.

 

As someone else said: this Whole30 program is not sustainable.  Even the authors of Whole30 say it isn't sustainable.  I use it as a reset when my sugar gets out of control.  

 

Choose one or the other.  I don't think both is possible.  But a program that teaches portion control and now finally focuses on truly being healthier?  Doesn't sound bad to me.

 

[MeadowLily]

Understood and appreciated, CreativeNikki.  People who need people are the luckiest people in the world.  Connection with others is a good thing.  

You enjoy those people and meetings. It's far better than bellying up to the bar and swilling rootbeers.  It's positive.

Edge your way down slowly and I believe in taking what we need from a bunch of different sources.  There's safety with a multitude of wise counselors. 

How will you proceed with the ww and counting your points.  I tbspn of mayo = 3 pts and if you're only allowed 30 for the day and 35 extra for the week, that depletes your daily allotment rather quickly.  See, I've been around the dieting merry-go-round all of the days of my life.

What do you want to do?