Matthew81

Why didn't I suffer? (Timeline not true for me at all.)

Recommended Posts

I'm on Day 14, and life is good.

Day 3 was the only rough spot. Cravings all morning, and "Kill All The Things" hit in the afternoon.

Both were gone by evening, and by Day 5, I had either "Boundless Energy" or perhaps even "Tiger Blood." And there I've stayed ever since. Energy is higher than I can ever remember, my mood is great, and I'm not craving a thing.

My diet has been 100% compliant except for a negligible amount of added sugar early on in that tricky turkey breast. The only other rule I've broken is that I've been weighing myself every day, because weight loss wasn't one of my objectives anyway and the data analyst in me wanted to see if there was a discernible weight pattern throughout the program (it's been a steady loss of 6lbs so far.) My meals match the template pretty closely and I'm not snacking much -- a serving or two of almonds in the afternoon, and another couple servings of nuts with a banana or half-serving of raisins at bedtime (no other dried fruit at any time; usually about four servings of fruit total per day.)

It's strange to ask if there's a problem when I'm feeling so incredible, but the fact that I basically had none of the unpleasant side effects makes me wonder if the great results I'm having are actually just a fraction of what I could expect if I'd have had to suffer for a while in the beginning. (And in that case, how can I make myself suffer? ;) ) Is it possible I need a longer, or more severe, detox? Or was I perhaps already in pretty good shape? (Hard to believe with the way I felt, although my diet was pretty good.)

Thoughts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi @Matthew81 - I would venture a guess that the four servings of fruit and the nuts you're snacking on have abated any cravings or sugar withdrawals, to be honest. Try to avoid snacking at all and if you do need to eat between meals, go for a protein and fat or protein and veggie. The nuts/raisins/banana thing before bed is definitely not advised. That won't do anything for you except raise your blood sugar right before bed. 

You don't have to suffer extra and the amount of "great" you get is not directly related to how hard you had to slog. :) Kick the nuts and fruits out, focus on making meals that keep you for 4-5 hours. You might notice a bit of a mental kick-up from your brain when you eliminate the fruit/nuts because my guess is they have been a stop-gap for you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That was quick. ;)

To clarify, I have one serving of fruit with each meal (not as a dessert) and then one more with the bedtime snack. Nuts are my main go-to snack.

The problem I've had with snacking is I can't seem to come up with a meal that will keep me for 4 or 5 hours without getting dizzy and light-headed in between. I've tinkered with the template to try to find something but just haven't hit on anything that works. It's the same with the bedtime snack; without it, I wake up around 2:00 am, dizzy and light-headed. (I'm not diabetic or hypoglycemic; my A1C is virtually perfect and the doctors told me to just go ahead and snack before bed if I need to.)

I'm very open to suggestions on how to avoid these problems, as I am fully aware of the problems with snacking and would prefer to not need to snack. It's definitely not an emotional thing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Matthew81 said:

That was quick. ;)

To clarify, I have one serving of fruit with each meal (not as a dessert) and then one more with the bedtime snack. Nuts are my main go-to snack.

The problem I've had with snacking is I can't seem to come up with a meal that will keep me for 4 or 5 hours without getting dizzy and light-headed in between. I've tinkered with the template to try to find something but just haven't hit on anything that works. It's the same with the bedtime snack; without it, I wake up around 2:00 am, dizzy and light-headed. (I'm not diabetic or hypoglycemic; my A1C is virtually perfect and the doctors told me to just go ahead and snack before bed if I need to.)

I'm very open to suggestions on how to avoid these problems, as I am fully aware of the problems with snacking and would prefer to not need to snack. It's definitely not an emotional thing.

OK, let's get a rundown on what your meals look like. Include meal timing, portion size related to the template, specific veggies and fats. Also include any exercise you're doing and pre and post workout food if applicable.

You definitely can snack before bed if needed but we would recommend you move towards a protein/fat or protein/veggie. The fruits are just a quick sugar-hit that doesn't really teach your body to access existing body fat for energy. Did you wake up in the middle of the night this way before Whole30? Or this is new?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK, here we go:

Workouts:
Brisk, 1.5 mile walk every weekday morning
Light (but increasing) strength training most weekday mornings
Workouts are before breakfast, no pre-workout meal but I do have a glass of water first.

Breakfast:
2 -3 eggs, usually fried over-easy in grapeseed oil or ghee
Lots of sauteed garden vegetables (Swiss chard, bell peppers, onions, spinach, etc.)
Rarely, a leftover baked potato cut in half and warmed in grapeseed oil or ghee
Fruit (usually 1/2 to 3/4 of a peach, a banana, or a few cherries)

Lunch:
Option 1:
Huge salad with compliant oil-and-vinegar dressing
Chicken, turkey, or hard-boiled eggs for protein
Fruit (usually a different selection than breakfast, but still a moderate serving size)
Option 2:
Template-serving of protein (chicken, hamburger, or turkey)
Lots of steamed vegetables
Fruit

Afternoon Snack:
(Not always required, although I haven't been able to pinpoint a pattern of this with my lunch choices.)
1 - 2 servings of raw almonds

Dinner:
Template-serving of meat
Lots of steamed vegetables, or a baked potato (rarely)
Fruit

Bedtime Snack:
1 - 2 servings of nuts
1/2 serving of raisins, or 1 banana

Notes:
I have had trouble waking up dizzy in the middle of the night for the last year or two, way before I even heard of Whole30. Having a snack within an hour of lying down eliminates the problem. I would rather not have to do this.

I am definitely not eating within one hour of getting up; actually I get up at 5:45 and don't eat until my family is ready at about 8:30. With three kids seven and under and a pregnant wife, schedule changes are difficult and it simply is not feasible to change this without cheating my sleep time too much (nor is it feasible to change the bedtime routine enough compensate.) Thus, I work out on an empty stomach and don't eat until breakfast, over 2 1/2 hours after getting up. This is admittedly sub-optimal, but such is life when you don't live alone. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would try eliminating the fruits for a while and fill up more on protein, veggies and fat at your meals. Fruit can sometimes cause false hunger or for a person to become hungrier sooner than if they didn't include it. It's worth at least trying. Not vilifying fruit but a worthwhile exercise to see how it goes. The template is also a range so a protein serving is anywhere between 1 and 2 palms. That's the length, width and thickness of your own palm and one to two servings. Eggs as a sole protein are as many as you can hold in your hand without dropping. If you're a bigger guy, you likely need either more than 3 or 3 plus another protein.

We also recommend at least one fist-sized serving of starchy veggie per day so your rare potato/starch should be showing up more. Once again, that fruit/nut snack before bed isn't helping your situation. Go for something more like a hard boiled egg or a chicken thigh and a bit of avocado. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK, I'll try that for a few days.

It's going to be difficult to increase the amount of protein and fat I eat. I forgot to mention above that I have gastritis, and too heavy of a meal causes nasty side effects (even worse if I'm hydrating properly). Still, I'll give it a try.

More fats though....wow. Most days it seems like I'm already having 8-10 tablespoons just in cooking oils and salad dressing.

And yes, I think I qualify as a "bigger guy." Not huge, but 200 pounds, 5' 10" tall, and only about 15% body fat isn't exactly small, either. :) I've thought for the past couple of years that my gastritis-impaired stomach just isn't able to handle enough food in only three meals to keep me going all day. But I'll give these suggestions a try and see what happens.

Thanks for all the help!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, laura_juggles said:

Unless you're scraping all the cooking fat onto your plate, all that cooking oil really isn't adding much to the total you're eating. 

Perhaps. I don't have a good way to test it. All I know is I put between one and two tablespoons in the pan before I fry my eggs, and when I scoop the eggs out, there's only a tiny bit of it left. And the same with meats, stir fried vegetables, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you've got an underlying medical condition, there'd be nothing wrong with eating 4 smaller meals a day. Skip all the nuts and fruit, just add in another meal that also has protein, veggies, and some fats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Matthew81 said:

Perhaps. I don't have a good way to test it. All I know is I put between one and two tablespoons in the pan before I fry my eggs, and when I scoop the eggs out, there's only a tiny bit of it left. And the same with meats, stir fried vegetables, etc.

I mean, a pretty easy way to test it is to add a little more fat to your meals and see if that stops your need for snacking. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, laura_juggles said:

I mean, a pretty easy way to test it is to add a little more fat to your meals and see if that stops your need for snacking. 

That's actually something I've tested before. Unfortunately, it appears to just aggravate my gastritis and make me miserable and unproductive for the rest of the day. But that was pre-Whole30 so the situation may change with time if this system really does some of the things it's supposed to do. So far, although I've noticed dramatic improvement in several areas of life, gastritis symptoms are not one of them, so I've been reluctant to go too hog-wild with the fats. Still, it may just take some time to heal and it may have to be done in layers. If it does eventually heal the gastritis, then perhaps I'll be able to work more on fat intake.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/18/2018 at 8:40 AM, Matthew81 said:

...

It's strange to ask if there's a problem when I'm feeling so incredible, but the fact that I basically had none of the unpleasant side effects makes me wonder if the great results I'm having are actually just a fraction of what I could expect if I'd have had to suffer for a while in the beginning. (And in that case, how can I make myself suffer? ;) ) Is it possible I need a longer, or more severe, detox? Or was I perhaps already in pretty good shape? (Hard to believe with the way I felt, although my diet was pretty good.)

Thoughts?

 

It is not strange to feel good!  Feeling good is one of the biggest advantages of eating healthy. 

I was totally compliant for the first 35 days with the exception of perhaps enjoying too much fruit during the time.  I am some 5 months or so into my new lifestyle of eating better and with very little exercise I have shed 40 pounds... and quite honestly, it was one of the easiest things I have ever done, but I had the girth to give up.  And I have had absolutely no bad side effects. 

For me, post W30, I have reintroduced alcohol and dairy only in the form of plain yogurt ... the former I have been enjoying perhaps a little but too much.  But, my attitude towards food is so much better and I am avoiding any added sugar (as an ingredient) at all costs.  I am, however, enjoying too much fruit especially with all the fresh farm stuff that is rolling in at this time of year.  I realize that I am overdoing it, but for now I am OK with as long as it is me who is understanding how I react to it. 

As long as whether one needs "longer or more sever detox" my opinion would be to not go too harsh on one's self.  For me, I have learned so much from following the W30 concept.  After the 30 I let myself enjoy wine, spirits and fresh fruit to a bit of excess which is not following The Rules.  But, I know how easy that eating is for me and I am within the early days on a new Mini 30 where I will try to reduce the fruit intake but eliminate alcohol.  I do have another 20 pounds that I could drop... but my attitude is to treat myself well.  And what I mean by that is:  enjoy the compliments from folks who have noticed my weight loss,  enjoy the better attitude and well being, enjoy fitting into clothes that were at the limits of the thread stitching.  I indulged on some items and now it is time to step back into a regime again.  Baby steps, baby.

Only the individual can make the best judgments for themselves.  For me it was following The Rules for 30 days and then assess.  For me it meant enjoying the Whole process of the initial strictness, enjoying and being proud, reassessment and then adjusting my reintroduction and how to implement it for my next phases... I did not want to burn out and lose momentum and attitude.   By someone asking if longer or more severe detox might be a positive mental thought but the implementation might cause one to burn out. 

JMOO... congrats on your success thus far

frank.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi, 

I know this thread is from awhile ago, but I have been having the same issue and I'm wondering if maybe I'm making the same mistake. I am on day four off the whole30. I felt really tired on day 1 and had a migraine (I have chronic migraines too), but other than that I'm just a little tired in the afternoons. I am super hungry all the time though. My meals look like this:

Breakfast: 3 scrambled eggs with coconut milk (approved brand), coffee with coconut milk

Lunch/snack: leftovers from dinner (has been kale and red cabbage slaw, mashed cauliflower, and chicken), chia pudding with coconut milk and fruits

*chia pudding I usually eat as a snack before or after lunch

Dinner: whole30 approved meal such as the lunch described below. I also usually cook with Ghee, although the only one I could find is mixed with grapeseed oil. Is this okay? 

Sometimes watermelon after dinner

 

I have had cravings when I see treats, but have been able to manage them. I am happy that I'm not suffering, but I know that I have an unhealthy relationship with sugar treats and so I can't imagine it's this easy. 

 

Thoughts? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

2 hours ago, Olga21 said:

Hi, 

I know this thread is from awhile ago, but I have been having the same issue and I'm wondering if maybe I'm making the same mistake. I am on day four off the whole30. I felt really tired on day 1 and had a migraine (I have chronic migraines too), but other than that I'm just a little tired in the afternoons. I am super hungry all the time though. My meals look like this:

Breakfast: 3 scrambled eggs with coconut milk (approved brand), coffee with coconut milk

Lunch/snack: leftovers from dinner (has been kale and red cabbage slaw, mashed cauliflower, and chicken), chia pudding with coconut milk and fruits

*chia pudding I usually eat as a snack before or after lunch

Dinner: whole30 approved meal such as the lunch described below. I also usually cook with Ghee, although the only one I could find is mixed with grapeseed oil. Is this okay? 

Sometimes watermelon after dinner

 

I have had cravings when I see treats, but have been able to manage them. I am happy that I'm not suffering, but I know that I have an unhealthy relationship with sugar treats and so I can't imagine it's this easy. 

 

Thoughts? 

Depending how healthy your diet was before, you might not suffer - I think the timeline sets out the worst case scenario so that people aren't surprised if its really bad, but there are many of us who just seem to truck through. Neither round did I get any of the nasty effects, but my diet pre-W30 was pretty healthy - I'm doing it to establish intolerance to foods, and my existing diet was already full of good quality meat and veggies, just also with dairy, gluten, artificial sweeteners etc. 

Grapeseed oil is an 'only if it can't be avoided while out' oil - you really should shop around for pure ghee. I've never actually seen one that is mixed, actually - have you looked in the international foods section? It's often not with the oils. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Olga21 said:

Hi, 

I know this thread is from awhile ago, but I have been having the same issue and I'm wondering if maybe I'm making the same mistake. I am on day four off the whole30. I felt really tired on day 1 and had a migraine (I have chronic migraines too), but other than that I'm just a little tired in the afternoons. I am super hungry all the time though. My meals look like this:

Breakfast: 3 scrambled eggs with coconut milk (approved brand), coffee with coconut milk

Lunch/snack: leftovers from dinner (has been kale and red cabbage slaw, mashed cauliflower, and chicken), chia pudding with coconut milk and fruits

*chia pudding I usually eat as a snack before or after lunch

Dinner: whole30 approved meal such as the lunch described below. I also usually cook with Ghee, although the only one I could find is mixed with grapeseed oil. Is this okay? 

Sometimes watermelon after dinner

 

I have had cravings when I see treats, but have been able to manage them. I am happy that I'm not suffering, but I know that I have an unhealthy relationship with sugar treats and so I can't imagine it's this easy. 

 

Thoughts? 

Chia pudding is specifically not recommended. You’re also not eating the meal template, have you seen that link? You need added fat and vegetables with your eggs in the morning, for example. 

Make your own ghee, it’s super easy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was actually going to say the same as @Pandora Black regarding the chia pudding...
here's an old (but good) forum topic that covers it in some detail.

Also, ditto on the fat source... my family actually prefers cooking in coconut oil for nearly everything now (even compared to the ghee we tried during reintro month and after), then opting for olive oil when we're roasting (since the coconut oil smokes out a house quickly with higher temps).

Here's the meal template link Pandora mentioned, also.

My suggestion would be to ditch the chia pudding for the duration, switch to a fully compliant cooking fat, and get your meals to match the template by adding more vegetables in general (including at least a serving of starchy vegetable per day)... as well as letting go of the fruit at least for a few days. Remember that a starving sugar dragon will use any ploy possible to get you to give in, including convincing you that fruit is a wonderfully healthy choice (which just happens to be packed with natural sugars, but you're not supposed to realize that)!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Jihanna said:

I was actually going to say the same as @Pandora Black regarding the chia pudding...
here's an old (but good) forum topic that covers it in some detail.

Also, ditto on the fat source... my family actually prefers cooking in coconut oil for nearly everything now (even compared to the ghee we tried during reintro month and after), then opting for olive oil when we're roasting (since the coconut oil smokes out a house quickly with higher temps).

Here's the meal template link Pandora mentioned, also.

My suggestion would be to ditch the chia pudding for the duration, switch to a fully compliant cooking fat, and get your meals to match the template by adding more vegetables in general (including at least a serving of starchy vegetable per day)... as well as letting go of the fruit at least for a few days. Remember that a starving sugar dragon will use any ploy possible to get you to give in, including convincing you that fruit is a wonderfully healthy choice (which just happens to be packed with natural sugars, but you're not supposed to realize that)!

Thank you for linking everything I was too lazy to google myself ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you everyone for the advice and links! I am going to try and make some adjustments. I'll also look for some different Ghee or make my own. We only have the one option with the cooking oils, but I'll check the international section too! I definitely read the rules and didn't look further into the meal template. I had a feeling something was off when I wasn't having a more difficult time (not that I want to, but I also know how many chocolates and cookies I was eating before hand). Thanks so much!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎6‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 5:07 AM, Olga21 said:

Thank you everyone for the advice and links! I am going to try and make some adjustments. I'll also look for some different Ghee or make my own. We only have the one option with the cooking oils, but I'll check the international section too! I definitely read the rules and didn't look further into the meal template. I had a feeling something was off when I wasn't having a more difficult time (not that I want to, but I also know how many chocolates and cookies I was eating before hand). Thanks so much!!

Some other ideas for cooking fats... bake a sheet pan of bacon in the oven until yummy and crispy.  Poor the hot bacon fat through a fine sieve or a coffee filter into a jar and store in the fridge. I love using this for cabbage, morning hashes, roasting Brussel sprouts.   

Roast a whole chicken in the oven. Pour all the juices into  a measuring cup and store in the fridge. The juices and fat will separate and the fat will harden. you can then scrape that off and store it in the fridge to use for cooking. Good all purpose cooking fat and it has very slight chicken flavor. In addition, you can put those now solidified roasting juices into bone broth, or stock, or use for sauces. It's delicious! 

I'm not a huge fan of coconut oil, but the triple filtered one Trader Joe's carries doesn't taste much like coconut and does cook things like stir-fry very nicely. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now