Stomach troubles caused by gallbladder removal?

[broyleshill]

I'm on day 23 and I have been having stomach issues since day 1, basically this has been nausea and diarrhea I have had an intolerance to wheat and dairy for over 10 years, and i had my gallbladder removed 2 years ago.

After lurking in these threads I have started drinking kombucha (~1/4 bottle a day), yesterday I started taking a digestive enzyme with ox bile in it with my meals, and I made some bone broth. I am concerned that i just can't handle all the fat. I've been eating about a 1/4 of an avocado with each meal, and cooking in coconut oil. I haven't had any avocado for the last day.

Yesterday I had:

1st meal. Shredded sweet potato, 2 eggs and bell pepper

2nd meal: Ground turkey with tinned toms, bell pepper and roasted sweet potato and parsnips

Snack to try and settle my stomach: banana and cashew butter

3rd meal: Well Fed Chilli with mashed sweet potato

My meals yesterday are not quite representative of how i have been eating all month, normally i have more vegetables, but i just wasn't feeling up to much in the way of cooking. However, I have been eating sweet potato nearly everyday.

This morning I had:

Pork sausage and sweet potato and some bone broth and i'm still feeling nausea.

I can't figure out if i have a bug as I also have some symptoms of a headcold, and Virginia appears to be ground zero for the flu this winter, or if it's the food. Any suggestions?

[Renee Lee]

Probably a little of column A and a little of column B. In your situation, I would ease up on the fat, and rely more on starchy carbohydrates for your caloric needs.

It's hard without a gall bladder, and the transition may be harder/longer for you.

[Guest]

Hey broyleshill,

I am a newbie and just saw your post. I have had terrible post-gallbladder issues in recent years. I am hoping that you are responding better to the healthy fats now. I am hoping for the same with myself. I am on day 7 and healthy fats seem to be helpiing my situation, but I know that the digestive system is a little confused in the beginning anyway.

Please let us know how you are doing.

Nico

[Robin Strathdee]

Hi all!

I am GB-less, as well. The fats in coconut products don't require bile for breakdown, so those are a good option for getting in healthy fats

[Guest]

Robin, I am also sans-gallbladder and I am seeing that a lot of the fats seem to be getting to me. I am on day 9 and have had a lot of good moments so far, but there seem to be more nauseous and painful moments now. I have had what my doctor called a "bile salt imbalance" for a while and medication helped a little.

I have gone through old posts, but haven't seen much detail about the body's response to the fats in the Whole30 without a gallbladder. I have started a bit of a diary to see which ones bother me and am sticking with ginger and carbonation when my stomach really doesn't respond well. I am curious if my body will be able to adapt to other fats or if I should start eliminating the ones that definitely bother me. I know digestive issues are normal during this transition and can take time to resolve, but I'd love to hear from those with experience.

Thanks,

Nico

[Robin Strathdee]

Do you take any enzymes? I would absolutely journal to see how each fat affects you! Maybe stick to one type per day, and then have an "easy fat" day between if your system needs a calm down? My body, honestly, does perfectly fine with reasonable amounts of fat at each meal. Every once in a while, things get a little...loosey goosey... but a day or two of enzymes with ox bile clears that up. Now, I'm okay with the fact that I'll never poop like my kids (things are all over the map and have been since I can remember), so your mileage may vary

[Guest]

I only take cholestyramine and it has aspertame, but could have been filled without it. It is a powder that I take in a very tiny amount in order to obtain a very powerful effect, but I know I can get by for one month without it to avoid further confusion. I may not need it when I develop a better understanding. My liver did fine for over a year without my gallbladder before I developed problems. I was vegetarian then. Hmmm...

I don't know anything about the enzymes. I can google enzymes and ox bile and see what I learn.

Salmon seems to be on the hit list right now along with fattier chicken. Those haven't bothered my in the same way on a non-Whole30 diet, though. I do know that my body loves coconut oil. I'll keep working on the list. And, I'll keep pushing ginger. I started kombucha and Natural Calm (hoping for a different kind of calm) last night and we're having kraut tonight.

Ah, yes...the days of a regular bathroom schedule. Even coffee can't force my modified body.

Thanks, Robin. Your insight is much-appreciated.

[melbournegirl]

Had my gall bladder out over 20 years ago

I recently tried digestive enzymes but they made my face puff up.

Sweet potato seem to help with regularity.

I find a small amount of fat beneficial in that it helps me to be full on less food. Eating too much causes an overload ( nausea, pain, slowed digestion, heartburn).

I tolerate meat and fats better when I don't have nuts.

Hope this provides some ideas for you broyleshill

[jeepifer]

I only take cholestyramine and it has aspertame, but could have been filled without it. It is a powder that I take in a very tiny amount in order to obtain a very powerful effect, but I know I can get by for one month without it to avoid further confusion. I may not need it when I develop a better understanding. My liver did fine for over a year without my gallbladder before I developed problems. I was vegetarian then. Hmmm...

I don't know anything about the enzymes. I can google enzymes and ox bile and see what I learn.

Salmon seems to be on the hit list right now along with fattier chicken. Those haven't bothered my in the same way on a non-Whole30 diet, though. I do know that my body loves coconut oil. I'll keep working on the list. And, I'll keep pushing ginger. I started kombucha and Natural Calm (hoping for a different kind of calm) last night and we're having kraut tonight.

Ah, yes...the days of a regular bathroom schedule. Even coffee can't force my modified body.

Thanks, Robin. Your insight is much-appreciated.

I take cholestyramine too! I had my gallbladder out 10 years ago, and my issues didn't start until about 6-7 years later. I believe grain consumption weakened my small intestine's ability to reabsorb bile. I'm hoping that the cholestyramine is a temporary stop-gap until I am healed enough to not need it.

I chose to continue to take it. Frankly, I don't know how I managed before, but it has helped immensely!

Digestive enzymes help, but with bile-absorption issue, were only part of the solution.

[Guest]

I loved my Whole30, but I have been pretty miserable for most of my 34-ish days. I really don't know what is "normal" for those of us without a gallbladder, but I know something isn't working. When I haven't eaten enough fat, I find myself snacking. Occasionally, combined fats seem to cause nausea. The big problem, though, is that I think I am getting backed up. My doctor told me I am doing OK if I go every four days. I have mostly been going on the third day. By the last meal of the second day, I start to puff up. This continue through subsequent meals and lasts longer after each meal. By the time I do go, I get the sour taste in my mouth and feel as though I am going to throw up. I have nausea and pain for about 30 minutes before and 15 minutes after the floodgates finally open.

I realize that I ate almost no fat between gallbladder removal and Whole30 (or even before gallbladder removal as fat was eliminated from my diet when I was 10). The only time I experienced the "backlog" and distended belly before was in the Fall when my doctor prescribed too much cholestyramine. Instead of 3 packets a day, I ended up on about 1/4 packet a day to stop what had been about 2 years of going 6 to 12 times a day. I wish I knew the relationship between cholestyramine, bile, and fat. If I did, I might be able to figure out the antidote.

Anyway, I've got ginger, Natural Calm, digestive enzymes, and kombucha on board. I bought some kimchi, but haven't worked it into a meal and need to try to get to Whole Foods in town to see if they have raw sauerkraut.

I am at a loss. I have a feeling my GI doctor will not approve of my new lifestyle, but I may call to get an appointment.

I'd really love it if others can share any experiences that might help.

[Guest]

And, the lady behind the seafood counter asked if I was pregnant. Some days, I looked at least five months along. For the record, I have not. I did lose 6 pounds during the first 6 days and my clothes fit so much better even though my belly is so round.

Then, when we were checking out with some compliant baby food in our cart, the checker wanted to know "how old." I could totally see that coming and the questions are all completely within reason.

I'll call Monday morning and see if my doctor has any ideas. I am off of the cholestyramine thanks to Whole30 and hope not to need meds.

[Robin Strathdee]

Nico -

I'm really kind of at a loss here. I don't have a gallbladder, but was never prescribed any medications after it was removed. I took digestive enzymes for a couple of months, but haven't needed them since. I tend to get most of my fat from coconut and avocado and I have no troubles as long as I avoid nuts. I don't go too little, or too much.

My guess is that this may not be a gallbladder issue. Could there be something else going on in there? I know it's easy to pin the blame on the most prominent medical condition we have (for me it was Crohn's), and often that can lead to misdiagnosis or doctors ignoring our symptoms (as was the case with my gallbladder).

I really have no suggestions - I just hope you get this one nailed down soon!

[Guest]

Thanks, Robin. I found an excellent GI doc recently. The symptoms are identical to what happened when she gave me too much of the cholestyramine for the bile salt imbalance. Several doctors checked me for Crohn's and Celiac's and lactose and fructose and things I could have gotten in countries I have never visited. The bile salt issue was the simple answer. It took a conversation and no procedures or blood draws. After 2.5 years of the opposite problem from the one I have now.

I can go back to her and describe this. I was trying to connect it to food, but it does seem to be more connected with how frequently I go which would likely be connected to foods I ate a day or two before I had problems. I have been on an almost no fat diet since the age of 10. I certainly hope I can make the argument for my new dietary choices and work with her to develop a healthier plan.

She's the doctor so I will let her try to figure it out. I hope she has an opening soon.

[Moluv]

In the meantime, if you are still backed up lay off the insoluble fiber and raw veggies. The last thing you need is more bulk- it just compounds the problem.

[jeepifer]

I'd suggest avoiding FODMAPS foods and see if that helps.

[Guest]

Thanks. We did evaluate FODMAPS in the past. I don't know if that would be something to revisit now.

I am terribly confused that I eliminated some foods and added fats and am having such issues with very few other changes. My husband wants to take me to Urgent Care, but I smile right through with my Whole30 high. Veggies are not new to me. I'll have to figure out the fiber ratios, though, Moluv, and make sure I am on target with that until I get an appointment.

I was so very regular before the gallbladder. It took about 18 months before the problems started and a long time to get the diagnosis. We got it fixed in the Fall and regular reappeared. Now, Whole30. I looked at the AIP protocols, but I think I will check with my doctor first as I have never had IBS/IBD before.

[Moluv]

I've been reading a lot today about subtle forms of autoimmune related problems- and it was shocking. Even though I have no official diagnosis I am switching to AIP because I am still having some problems after following the w30 for almost 2 months, which is what the w30 crew recommends too. I had just googled "autoimmune and paleo" to find the other info, but am sticking with w30 AIP protocol.

I mention this all because, like Robin said, it's easy to start blaming the most major medical issue, but it really could be so many things. Just think of it this way, TRYING the AIP for a couple weeks certainly isn't going to harm you.

[Guest]

Agreed. My diet was pretty carefully calculated to control my blood sugar. During my first 30 days, my N30 was 100 which is the best I could hope for. So, making another dramatic change could be a bit detrimental. I do have some wiggle room now and read it again this morning. I thought it said to try it for 90 days.

I am resisting a little because we really got the hang of this at our house now. Part of our psychological energy is coming from the variety we are eating and the rhythm that we have now comes from doing it together. Starting over will take a lot of starting over energy and I'm not quite ready. I will likely try it, but am still curious: if these symptoms mimic the exact antidote to the original bile salt imbalance, maybe my doctor can tell me how cholestyramine works and what may have tipped the balance in the opposite direction.

This may not even be Whole30 related...I did have one really good week.

[Moluv]

A lot of that stuff goes over my head- and certainly my suggestions are just based off my own experience and my physician, Dr. Internet. I really hope you get to the bottom (no pun intended) of your digestive troubles.

[Moluv]

Are you diabetic? If so, Type 1 or 2?

[Guest]

I have Type 2 diabetes. My pre-W30 A1c was 5.9 which is pretty amazing. I was using the plate method and exercise. (Imagine our template, but with grains where we have fats, sort of.) Anyway, it would probably be even closer to normal now, so my previous physician would give me permission to be less strict. I'm only 35, so I'm going to do my best to keep my blood glucose in check so that my body is getting correct circulation. Sorry, Doc. Thanks to comments here, I found a nearby doc who practices functional medicine, but he is moving. There is a PA at his office who is staying and I have an appointment with her soon. I'll certainly be on the phone to GI and to her office to see who can see me first. I am sort of wondering if something happened mid-Whole30 that another person would have found troubling but I associated with Whole30.

I am excited that you have found so much success. I know who to reach out to for tips on the AIP if I head down that path.

[Tina R]

Check out this radio interview done by Sean Croxton talking with Dr. Michael Ruscio about how too much bile can cause digestive problems as well as you might have problems with the last part of your intestine. Sometimes it can't reabsorb the bile. This is a compilation of different interviews. The one with Dr Ruscio begins at 17:45. I hope you find a solution soon. By the way Sean Croxton has some amazing interviews on his Underground Wellness program. He even interviewed the Hartwigs.  https://www.youtube.com/user/UndergroundWellness/videos.