yerocasil Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 I have a few AIP questions. I have tried to search, but didn't see the answers. I am on day 29 of my original Whole 30, and on day 25 I switched to AIP. One question I have is can I add a small amount of sugar after day 30? I'm thinking the sugar in bacon or lunchmeat (assuming there is nothing else like carageenan in them). I'm just looking for a few more options (and thinking I'm going to have to do at least 90 days of AIP, so if I could add some things it would be helpful). I don't want to add it if it will prevent my gut from healing, but 1) I don't need to lose weight (in fact I really should not lose any weight so some added calories would help) and 2) I feel like my sugar dragon is under control. If I keep a watch and make sure those things aren't causing more cravings would it be harmful to my gut? Also, I've searched for answers about kombucha and fermented veggies as well. I recently purchased some kombucha and fermented saurkraut (wanted to try before venturing into making my own). I've read to start slow with kombucha, so I am doing about 2 oz a day. I'm also trying to add in gelatin and bone broth. Should I be using all of these daily or only one or does it matter? Can you take too much of these "superfoods?" Lastly, most lists for AIP I've seen include: Nightshades, nuts/seeds, eggs, alcohol, NSAIDS. In ISWF they mention fruits that can't be peeled (grapes, cherries) as well as fruits with seeds that are rough (stawberries, raspberries) and for IBS/IBD (which is what I am dealing with) they also mention citrus. Are these extra things from ISWF only recommended if you have trouble with them? I've also heard you may need to avoid FODMAPS. Initially, I figured I would just follow the list I've seem most often, but I tried some coconut butter yesrday all alone and it made me feel awful, with stomach cramping and nausea for several hours. Definitely not worth it, so I will be avoiding coconut (except oil) . I didn't know if I need to avoid those other things only if there is a problem (similar to the coconut) or if keeping them in is going to hinder the healing of my gut? Any thoughts would be so appreciated (I underlined the questions, I know there are a lot)! Thanks!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Tom Denham Posted April 2, 2013 Moderators Share Posted April 2, 2013 Any sugar feeds is preferred food for harmful bacteria in your gut. There is plenty of good food to eat without resorting to bacon cured with sugar. Besides, bacon is not good food. It is tasty, but not even close to being a good protein choice. You just have to figure things out. I've published 400 Whole30-compliant recipes and can easily publish another 400 more, so I know it is just a matter of thinking things through to find interesting meals to eat. You can overdose on fermented foods, but several servings per day should not be a problem. I drank a bottle of kombucha and ate a big serving of kimchi (fermented cabbage from Korea) yesterday. However, I started drinking kombucha with one bottle per day. It upset my stomach for 2-3 days and then I was fine. I've never had problems with sauerkraut or kimchi. The foods listed on page 238 of It Starts With Food are the Whole9 protocol for IBS/IBD. If that is what you are dealing with, that page applies to you now. The general recommendation is to follow the protocol completely 60-90 days and begin reintroducing foods only after you have seen symptomatic improvement and ideally improvement in inflammatory lab markets. It is a bad idea to draw conclusions that something is not bothering you quickly because the problems may be subtle and easily over looked. By staying with the protocol a substantial period, you give your body a chance to heal and get you to a new place where you may be able to eat foods that previously caused trouble. FODMAPS may be a problem, but the general idea with them is to eliminate only after you have not had a good experience with the AIP protocol over a 60-90 day period. Most people do okay with coconut, but some don't. I'm sorry it hurts you. Hopefully that will resolve itself over the next few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yerocasil Posted April 2, 2013 Author Share Posted April 2, 2013 Thanks Tom, that helps a lot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yerocasil Posted April 2, 2013 Author Share Posted April 2, 2013 Though, can I add that while I hear you that there are lots of recipes for Whole 30 compliant meals, AIP seems so much more limited to me. I keep looking for recipes and there is always something that makes them non-compliant for me (and I'm trying to cook for myself and my family keeping them from being bored and wanting to stick with this). Especially now that coconut bothers me too. If that makes sense? I really didn't feel that limited when I was doing the normal Whole 30, and maybe in a little while this wont seem so bad either, but switching has been rough. Even when I find "autoimmune" friendly recipes there is often something I can't eat and I'm not sure if it is because people view AIP differently, but I see people eating cocoa or honey or citrus or fruit and others saying to avoid those things. I just find it confusing as well. And, I wasn't thinking I would eat bacon everyday or anything. Just something different at times to mix it up. Lunchmeat as well, I know it also isn't ideal and I wouldn't eat it everyday, but the idea that I would have something quick (lunchmeat) on days when I just need to grab something was really what I was thinking. But I do appreciate your response and am just trying to make this work. I know it isn't long, but 60-90 days is feeling like forever right about now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yerocasil Posted April 2, 2013 Author Share Posted April 2, 2013 I have been perusing your recipes Tom and am seeing some that will work, so that gives me some hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moluv Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 People on AIP shouldn't even read recipes. I was excited to get "Practical Paleo" from the library because it has a whole section of meal plans for AIP. Every. Single. Recipe. Uses. Spices. Spices are seeds. If I'm to avoid seeds for a month shouldn't I avoid mustard and cumin too? Maybe I'm wrong. Either way I find with all of my exclusions to follow w30 AIP plus my own issues with FODMAPs, high insoluble fiber and raw veggies, plus seasonal organic availability recipes just end up either making me frustrated or making me "slip". Know your full range if appropriate ingredients and know how to cook and just go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Strathdee Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Mo - I think the exclusion of seeds comes from the fiber/digestibility/gut irritation rather than a compound in the seed. Most spices have been so finely obliterated that there is no real fiber left to cause irritation Stay away from paprika and other nightshade derivatives and you should be okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moluv Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Thanks for clearing that up Robin. P.S. I didn't mean don't read Tom's recipes lol I just reread my post and that first line didn't come out right! I have several of Tom's earmarked for the holidays and post-AIP healing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moluv Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 I think other people (not just here but on the Internet) don't know that spices (except nightshades) are ok because I have come across lots of folks also not eating seed spices as well as detailed charts about which are seed heads. Now I am even more confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Strathdee Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Okay, holy confusing information Batman! I should NEVER have Googled it It looks like some folks throw out the phytate/Omega 6/lectin thing for avoiding spices that come from seeds. I suppose that could be the case... but the arguments look a little slim to me. If you're IBS and not full AIP, you're probably okay with most spices. BUT if you're full AIP, at least for the first 30 days, you will want to stick to the "safe" spices. Here's a list I found: http://www.thepaleomom.com/2012/07/spices-on-autoimmune-protocol.html Sometimes, I should just go with whatever I blurt out first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yerocasil Posted April 3, 2013 Author Share Posted April 3, 2013 I agree! I've seen that you shouldn't include cumin and celery and nutmeg and mustard. I keep leaving things out of recipes that I would love to use if it is okay. I knew not to use cayenne or paprika or other nightshade spices, but if I can keep the others that would be huge! Frankly, I think the whole AIP is confusing. It seems everyone you read has different ideas of what to include/exclude. I understood what you meant about the recipes Moluv . I was also super excited to read Pracital Paleo, but found many of the recipes can't be used on the AIP too; it is frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yerocasil Posted April 3, 2013 Author Share Posted April 3, 2013 Seems we were writing at the same time Robin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moluv Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 I agree! I've seen that you shouldn't include cumin and celery and nutmeg and mustard. I keep leaving things out of recipes that I would love to use if it is okay. I knew not to use cayenne or paprika or other nightshade spices, but if I can keep the others that would be huge! Frankly, I think the whole AIP is confusing. It seems everyone you read has different ideas of what to include/exclude. I understood what you meant about the recipes Moluv . I was also super excited to read Pracital Paleo, but found many of the recipes can't be used on the AIP too; it is frustrating. Yes- everyone has it different and that's what I meant. I was also excited about Practical Paleo and the very first meal on the AIP was mustard glazed chicken. I wanted it to be "oregano chicken" or whatever that I already felt safe with. But really, who needs a recipe for putting herbs on a piece of chicken. If you need to know how long or what temp to cook chicken at, then by all means study cooking methods. But for AIP I think the very idea of recipes is an oxymoron, because when things have gone that far and you are reacting to so many things, the best thing to do is look deeply into yourself and learn what is and is not safe to eat and not even pay attention to what others can or can't eat. That is something I struggle with on the forums is getting distracted from my safe foods by what other people are feeling safe with on AIP. I've also noticed a LOT of the AIP paleo bloggers like to have SWYPO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moluv Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Okay, holy confusing information Batman! I should NEVER have Googled it It looks like some folks throw out the phytate/Omega 6/lectin thing for avoiding spices that come from seeds. I suppose that could be the case... but the arguments look a little slim to me. If you're IBS and not full AIP, you're probably okay with most spices. BUT if you're full AIP, at least for the first 30 days, you will want to stick to the "safe" spices. Here's a list I found: http://www.thepaleomom.com/2012/07/spices-on-autoimmune-protocol.html Sometimes, I should just go with whatever I blurt out first That is one of the lists I've been using. The time I've spent on the AIP has been profoundly transformative. I'm taking a few days break to eat chocolate and ghee then I'm goig right back in with the strictness. It takes some new ways of thinking, but O.P. I know you can do it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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