Why is bone broth allowed?

[Fancy_Bird]

It's not clear to me why, although it is healthy, bone broth isn't disallowed as "liquid calories." And what are the rules/advice about when to drink it? Only with meals, or pre-WO, or post-WO, or all, or none?

I Googled and searched the forums but didn't find an answer. Thanks in advance.

[MeadowLily]

Bone Broth is one of the oldest human foods known to man.  You drink it or cook with it. Whole 30 is not a diet so we're not counting liquid calories.  

 

http://whole9life.com/2013/12/whole9-bone-broth-faq/

 

 

http://whole30.com/2016/02/bare-bones-broth-cookbook/

 

 

https://www.barebonesbroth.com/blog/bare-bones-whole30-approved/

[Fancy_Bird]

Not to be argumentative, but that's not true. ITSW contains several discussions about liquid calories, including the sections on sugar-laden, dairy-laden coffee drinks; protein shakes; juiced fruit and veggies; and smoothies. Liquid calories are absolutely a concern in Whole30 and, I think, rightfully so. So I'm just wondering why bone broth is allowed.

[MeadowLily]

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[MeadowLily]

Bone Broth is an actual food on the approved list.

 

 

None of these items  sugar-laden, dairy-laden coffee drinks; protein shakes; juiced fruit and veggies; and smoothies are on the approved list and recommendations. Whole 30 is not a diet with calorie, macro or micro counting.   The coconut milk that is used in recipes will not be counted either.

You simply enjoy the foods on the lists above without counting.

[Fancy_Bird]

Maybe I'm just being dense. I get that the drinks I listed aren't allowed, and I get why. I get that bone broth is allowed, but what I don't get is why. I don't get the logic. It can't be that humans have been eating it for millennia or whatever, because the Hartwigs specifically reject "arguments from history" like that in ISWF. It also can't be that bone both has nutrients, because even though fruit and veggie juices can have nutrients, they're still out in part because "liquid calories aren't as satisiating as real food." (From ISWF; sorry, have the Kindle version so can't cite to a page.)

Bone broth doesn't have sugar like juice does, so I'm not saying I think they're nutritionally equal. I'm just saying that one of the stated reasons in ISWF for not drinking even juice you juiced yourself is that it's "liquid calories" and "[not] real food." I don't get why that reason wouldn't also support not drinking bone broth.

I do admit that, while you shouldn't drink juice, you can eat fruit, and it's not like we can eat bones. Maybe bone broth is the only way to get the beneficial nutrients of bones into our bodies. Well, then I feel like the logical solution would be, "Make a stew with it, use it in your zoodle sauce," etc. So I'm not questioning using it in cooking; I'm specifically questioning the drinking of it.

Please don't take my argumentativeness as offense! I'm happy bone broth is allowed, and I don't mind that juicing isn't. It's just when I don't get the logic of a rule, it drives me a little bit crazy. And I do feel that Whole30 endeavors to be logical, so I honestly expect there to be a logical answer that I just haven't thought of yet.

Anyway, I'll let this go. Just a friendly question, I swear -- I'm not trying to poke holes in the Whole30 program or anything. :-)

[Fancy_Bird]

I should also clarify that I get that not drinking juice and drinking bone broth are recommendations, not a rules. But I don't think that answers my question about the logic. It does, however, mean that this is not something for me (or anyone) to sweat over.

Have I mentioned I'm a lawyer? So I really like logic and friendly arguments :-) It's hard to make that come out when you're writing in a forum. So, I just want to emphasize one last time that this is a friendly question! :-)

[ShannonM816]

I think the fact that you don't get all the good stuff from bones most of the time unless you make broth from them is part of it. There's nothing you're going to get from fruit juice that you wouldn't get from just eating the fruit, plus if you just eat the fruit you're getting those nutrients, plus the fiber which juicing tends to strip away from it.

 

There's also the fact that many people use fruit juices/smoothies when they have sugar cravings, and that craving for something sweet (sugar dragon) is something Whole30 aims to get rid of. Even vegetable juices tend to be somewhat sweet. Broth tends not to be sweet and is unlikely to feed into those cravings and keep them going.

 

If you want to get into the actual calorie part of the liquid calories, broth tends to have fewer for the same volume of liquid. Using information from Bare Bones Broth, 6 oz of their broth (from which the fat has not been totally removed, since nutrition information lists .3 g fat per serving) has 48 calories. A google search for unsweetened apple juice say it has 14 cal/oz, so 6 oz of it would have 84 calories. Carrot juice would have 72 calories in 6 oz.  Whole30 doesn't particularly concern itself with calories, and there's no way to know for sure exactly how many calories your particular batch of broth would contain anyway, but it's just one more way of showing that there is some difference. Plus, besides the difference in calories, most people are more likely to drink a lot more fruit juice than they would broth.

 

Another thing to consider is that one of the main points of the recommendation to avoid liquid calories/actually chew your food tends to be for people who would happily have a smoothie or a bulletproof coffee instead of a meal, and if someone were trying to use broth that way, I feel safe in saying that no one at Whole30 would say that's okay. Even though broth has some protein, it's still not the same as actually eating a real meal.

[MeadowLily]

http://whole30.com/2013/02/you-count-more-than-your-calories-do/

 

See comments, too.

[Tom Denham]

The Whole30 leaves room for any participant to ruin their results by going to extremes. We tell you how to compose meals and provide lots of guidance about "best practices," but as long as you do not eat a non-compliant ingredient for 30 days, you can say you completed a Whole30. Liquid calories are not banned, we simply advise you that liquid food does not function as an equivalent of whole foods and messes with satiety signals. 

 

Bone broth is liquid food, but bone broth is not like anything else. It is not like fruit juice or veggie smoothies or entire pureed meals. Consuming one to three mugs of bone broth per day fits nicely with the Whole30 approach to eating. However, you would be violating all that is good about a Whole30 if you used bone broth in place of any meal or even as the dominant portion of a meal. 

 

I've been eating Whole30-style for 6 years now. I started making and consuming bone broth years ago and now find that drinking two mugs of bone broth is one of the most valuable things I can do to sleep well at night. There is something about bone broth/collagen that supplies my body with something that helps me stay sleepy all night long. I would drink bone broth every day if it was banned by the Whole30. But of course, the Whole30 embraces bone broth/collagen because it is consistent with eating real, whole foods. 

[Fancy_Bird]

Thank you all for your thoughtful answers! It sounds like the benefits of bone broth simply outweigh the fact that they are liquid calories. It's also interesting to hear that we truly are meant to sip it as one would tea (i.e., not necessarily as part of a meal), because a post containing that very point was what sent me down this confusing road to begin with. So it's good to have that confirmed. And I definitely take your point that one is not likely to get a debilitating bone broth craving, the way one would with the sugar in a smoothie. :-) Thanks again!

[JanaBrown]

I have been making bone broth for a long time. I use it to cook but I mostly use it as tea or coffee. I don't season mine when I make it so I usually add a touch of salt. I also use it as a warm-up when coming in from the barn or out in cooler weather if I am cold. 

[dpearson]

I think the fact that you don't get all the good stuff from bones most of the time unless you make broth from them is part of it. There's nothing you're going to get from fruit juice that you wouldn't get from just eating the fruit, plus if you just eat the fruit you're getting those nutrients, plus the fiber which juicing tends to strip away from it.

 

 

This!