On the delicate subject of diarrhea...

[Mamatutu]

Hey folks.  I'm currently on day 22 of my 2nd W30.  I started my first back in February and it lasted 42 days.  However, throughout the time I suffered from loose and uncomfortable bowels and put this down to my gut healing.  I did a slow reintro, I've not reintroduced any grains other than rice, no legumes and minimal diary (only milk and then only occasionally in a cup of tea) and kept away from sugar in its most obvious forms (just not been a label hawk eliminating it from every source possible).  BUT... the bowel issues haven't let up at all and back on a strict W30 intake I've got worse if anything.  On the plus side I feel great and it took only a matter of days to get back to sleeping right and lose my sore neck (from an old whiplash injury).  I get stomach cramps before I need to use the bathroom and have no visible bloating or discomfort... just really loose bowels.

 

On my first round of W30 I had a lot of chicken bone broth and wondered if the nutrient denseness of that was too much for my digestion? I carried on having it even after I stepped down the plan a bit.  This time though, I thought I'd avoid it and see if it made any difference and it hasn't!

 

So has anyone else experienced this and is it, as I still think, my poor mistreated long suffering gut trying to heal itself from the years of abuse I've put it through?

 

I'm starting a course of probiotics this week to see if that settles things a bit... just a thought but if someone thinks that might be worse please let me know...

 

Thanks all

 

Vikki

[GFChris]

Can you post 2-3 days worth of your typical Whole30 food log, including portion sizes and daily water consumption?  Also, it would be helpful to get an understanding of how different your Whole30 eating is from when you are not on a Whole30.  Do you also have bowel/diarrhea issues when you're not on a Whole30?

[Tom Denham]

Are you taking Natural Calm. I stopped taking Natural Calm a few months ago and found that my problems with looseness disappeared. Natural Calm is magnesium citrate. I started taking magnesium aspartate and the difference was profound. 

[Mamatutu]

_Saturday

_{M1 = 4 scrambled eggs over wilted kale cooked in EVOO with Franks hot sauce}

_{M2 = missed}

_{M3 = Roast chicken, olives, carrots and new potatoes}

 

_Yesterday

_{M1 = 2 eggs scrambled with 2 rashers bacon, several handfuls of kale and a chopped tomato.}

_{M2 = 6 slices Salt beef, 2 boiled eggs, spinach and tomatoes}

_{M3 = roasted chicken breast, green peppers and potato in curry sauce (curry spice mix, tomatoes and coconut milk) over green beans}

_{snack = a handful of dried fruit , Nakd gingerbread bar (I was on a training course...yes on a Sunday ... and was avoiding the free cookies on the table in any way possible!)}

 

_Today

_{M1 = crustless quiche of 4 eggs, coconut milk and tomatoes and a little mango coconut chia seed pudding}

_{M2 = Roast chicken, mixed salad greens, green olives and tomato}

_{M3 = (eating out so this wont be an exact measure ) Steak, new potatoes and vegetables.}

 

_{I drink 1 litre of plain water a day and about a litre of various herb/fruit teas (My mug at work holds 400ml and I have 3 or 4 a day of those). Yesterday I had a litre of coconut water too.}

 

 

_{As I explained... my non W30 diet is not so very different. I don't eat any grains except rice and then only rarely.  I have milk in a cup of tea maybe once or twice a week.  I've had chickpeas once since I finished my last W30 in March and no other legumes at all.  I don't eat candy and might have 70-85% cocoa solids dark chocolate once in a  while... I do not scrutinise every food label for added sugar though so will be having that without a doubt.  I've eliminated soda from my diet entirely and will not be allowing it back as it's just not healthy in any way shape or form. I suppose you could say I follow the W30 meal guidance but in a more relaxed way, my eye is slightly off the ball so to speak... and if I want it I'll have it (apart from bread, I absolutely cannot eat bread... it kills me, absolute agony for hours after and always has been the same).  I rarely drink alcohol but have had a glass of red wine now and then.}

 

_{My bowel issues did not abate between March and starting again 3 weeks ago.  Prior to my first W30 I had been constipated pretty much all the time... so this is quite a sea change for me!}

 

_{Taking dietary supplements is not so widely adhered to in the UK so I take none at all currently.  Would Magnesium help?}

[Mamatutu]

Well Day three of the probiotics and my tummy seems to be a happier environment.  I'll take them for 7 days and see how I fare.

[GFChris]

_Saturday

_{M1 = 4 scrambled eggs over wilted kale cooked in EVOO with Franks hot sauce}

_{M2 = missed}

_{M3 = Roast chicken, olives, carrots and new potatoes}

 

_Yesterday

_{M1 = 2 eggs scrambled with 2 rashers bacon, several handfuls of kale and a chopped tomato.}

_{M2 = 6 slices Salt beef, 2 boiled eggs, spinach and tomatoes}

_{M3 = roasted chicken breast, green peppers and potato in curry sauce (curry spice mix, tomatoes and coconut milk) over green beans}

_{snack = a handful of dried fruit , Nakd gingerbread bar (I was on a training course...yes on a Sunday ... and was avoiding the free cookies on the table in any way possible!)}

 

_Today

_{M1 = crustless quiche of 4 eggs, coconut milk and tomatoes and a little mango coconut chia seed pudding}

_{M2 = Roast chicken, mixed salad greens, green olives and tomato}

_{M3 = (eating out so this wont be an exact measure ) Steak, new potatoes and vegetables.}

 

_{I drink 1 litre of plain water a day and about a litre of various herb/fruit teas (My mug at work holds 400ml and I have 3 or 4 a day of those). Yesterday I had a litre of coconut water too.}

 

 

 

Was that day a typical day of fluid consumption for you, or is it more like two litres on average?  Two litres is 66 oz, which would be enough if you weighed 132 lbs.  Three litres is 99 oz, which would work if you were closer to 198 lbs.

 

I'm wondering if cutting back on the spicy foods would help (e.g., the hot sauce and curry)?

Also, I see a lot of tomatoes and raw vegetables: those can cause digestive distress. You might try dropping the tomatoes and switching to all cooked veggies and see if that helps.

Side note: the coconut chia seed pudding is a Paleo treat of fruit and fat (seeds are a fat on a Whole30). While it's good that you ate it as part of a meal with protein and veggies, sweetened treats are against the rules of the Whole30. I'd suggest avoiding this concoction until after your Whole30 is complete

[LadyM]

So many of us have issues with digestion and elimination and we sometimes forget that it's a truly systemic issue. Starting with food and the gut and probiotics, sometimes digestive enzymes as well as water intake is excellent. However, it often takes A LOT longer than we expect because it has to do with healing all kinds of organs, not just what's going into and out of the digestive tract.

 

The liver, for example, has a lot to do with it. Many of us suffer from clogged livers because of years of abuse with food and drink. It takes time. It's taken me two years of tweaking W30 style eating, working with a functional medicine doctor, finding the right supplementation, drinking plenty of water and getting the right kind and amount of exercise to have the kind of regular daily morning BM to be proud of. And you know what? It's been worth every second of vigilance to get here. Don't give up. Keep at it. You'll get there. It just may take longer than you expect.

[Mamatutu]

Thanks for the responses guys   I have been wondering if I should cut the nightshades for a while and see how I improve, so I shall look top try that for a few weeks and see where it gets me.  I've always eaten a lot of spicy food and it's not bothered me historically but now I'm eating so much cleaner I do wonder if it's now irritating my gut?  I would say the 2litres is a minimum consumption day and I'm closer to 3 most of the time. 

 

LadyM I agree this is a long haul to health and I in no way expect to be A1 100% after just a few months so I will persevere and eventually I know I will find my path (with regular detox/resets along the way).

 

Thanks guys

[Mamatutu]

So I went to see the doctor today and his initial thoughts are that I have Coeliac Disease.  This comes as no great surprise to me as I've struggled with intestinal issues after eating wheat for many years.  When I discovered W30 it was no a great awakening for me as I had already cut out most grains from my diet any way and on reading more about Coeliac I discover that a dairy sensitivity can also occur along side the gluten sensitivity.  So actually the W30 was a great idea for me and for a while I did feel a lot better.

 

Now... the thing is I need to have a bank of blood tests taken soon and in order to screen for Coeliac I need to eat gluten with every meal.  Luckily today is my day 30 of my 2nd W30 so my reintro plan will start with gluten by necessity but I will probably only have grains for the time being as I feel pretty rough right now and I think I need to be kind to my poor tummy.  The only downside is that I will have to eat it consistently for the next 6 weeks and I already know it's going to make me feel awful.  Again, has anyone else been through this before??

[jmcbn]

This is why many many people who 'know' they have coeliac, having seen dramatic improvements whilst eliminating gluten, don't bother with the official diagnosis. Why put yourself through the pain of eating gluten for six weeks when the only thing to gain is some prescription gluten free bread (which is full of other equally crap ingredients)?

Personally I'd just be happy that I 'know'.

[Mamatutu]

This is why many many people who 'know' they have coeliac, having seen dramatic improvements whilst eliminating gluten, don't bother with the official diagnosis. Why put yourself through the official diagnosis when the only thing to gain is some prescription gluten free bread (which is full of other equally crap ingredients)?

Personally I'd just be happy that I 'know'.

 

I hear you loud and clear! I am so NOT interested in gluten free alternatives.  My life has not ground to an impossible halt from the absence of bread, cereals and pasta... and I can already cheerfully slap any one who says 'but what do you eat for breakfast?' as though cereal was the only permitted food EVER for that meal!  But my issue is an unhappy gut SINCE eliminating it entirely so the Coeliac test will be one amongst many others.  On a happy note he seems to think that the BIG "C" word can be put at the bottom of the list for the moment as my symptoms are not consistent with bowel cancers.

[jmcbn]

I hear you loud and clear! I am so NOT interested in gluten free alternatives.  My life has not ground to an impossible halt from the absence of bread, cereals and pasta... and I can already cheerfully slap any one who says 'but what do you eat for breakfast?' as though cereal was the only permitted food EVER for that meal!  But my issue is an unhappy gut SINCE eliminating it entirely so the Coeliac test will be one amongst many others.  On a happy note he seems to think that the BIG "C" word can be put at the bottom of the list for the moment as my symptoms are not consistent with bowel cancers.

Can you not ask that they don't test specifically for coeliac, but do go ahead with all of the other tests? It's just one less tick on the form for the lab.

My son's allergist certainly advised us against putting him through that level of pain/inflammation just for the diagnosis....

[Mamatutu]

Can you not ask that they don't test specifically for coeliac, but do go ahead with all of the other tests? It's just one less tick on the form for the lab.

My son's allergist certainly advised us against putting him through that level of pain/inflammation just for the diagnosis....

 

Definitely one for a follow up with the doc I think.  Will try and see if I can call later today and ask him.

[Mamatutu]

It's not Coeliac thank goodness but more likely IBS so the GP sent me off to try low FODMAP now.  I decided to cover that with AIP also so here I am on day 8 of eating hardly anything at all hahahahaha.  The good news is that my tummy is almost deflated and I dropped 6lb this week, my trousers are fitting again and I feel relatively clear headed.  The bathroom issue is still prevalent but I'm taking probiotics again and being super vigilant on my diet. 

 

The recommendation for this has been to follow the clear out plan for 8 weeks so that's what I will do before reintroductions.  I have been referred to a gastroenterologist but it could be months before I get an appointment so I'm trying to figure this out myself. 

 

Anyone else doing low FODMAP with AIP?  Menu suggestions gratefully received!