Ali's Feel-Good, Gain Control, Marathon-training Whole 30

[Brewer5]

Brewer5--I am just now getting around to reading this FODMAP article. Thank you for including it. It's amazing how many FODMAP foods I eat, EVERY SINGLE DAY! Just about every day I eat nuts, avocado, broccoli, butternut squash, sweet potato, celery, banana, and some form of coconut. Every day. I can see now how these foods eaten in such abundance could lead to GI discomfort. I'm not quite sure what I'm going to do with this information...I'll have to think about it.

 

Right, Alison.  I know your mind doesn't really want to go there...  But it could really help you to know this information.

 

My suggestion would be to go to the green list for a couple of days... or however long it takes for your digestion to settle down.  Then add in your favorites one at a time, and see how you feel.  This would help you decide which foods are really "worth it" to you -- and which ones aren't.  And that way, at least you would know -- hey, if I eat ______ I am going to suffer from ________ -- which to me, was WAY better than looking 9 months pregnant at times (when clearly I'm not!    ) and being uncomfortable.

 

How are you doing with no nuts and no crio Bru?  (<-- I don't even know what this is.)

[Alisonlcarver]

So today is apparently my day to say "NO, you are WRONG" to everything you decide... sorry about that!

 

..."crio bru has an addictive factor to me"

 

I'm just saying this because I had the same conversation with myself over coffee... If you were to say "I'm going to give this up for 30 days and evaluate" I'd say "go you!".  But when you say it like this it reminds me of the thoughts I had over coffee... I was thinking of giving it up simply, well, because I liked it.  And it made me happy... I am "addicted" to it.  Sometimes I feel like when you are in the middle of a W30 it gets too easy to take "food is fuel" to the extreme.  Food CAN bring you joy and make you feel good - it is ok!  You've mentioned that you think your headaches (?) might be caused by this drink so if that is really what you are after go ahead and cut it, but if by addicted you mean "enjoy a few cups a day", who cares?  You told me earlier to give up my coconut butter - and you were correct - I eat that in an uncontrollable way.  But are you really sitting there sneaking in cups of Crio Bru when no one is looking and pouring it down your throat until you can't really taste it?  That is addictive eating.  Simply enjoying a cup of something a few times a day is simply that - enjoying something.  

 

Ok, off to find some more posts where I can say Ali you are WRONG

Littleg--I've been thinking about this quite a bit since you posted yesterday. You make several good points. I agree with you that the act of eating or drinking something that we enjoy is not a bad thing. I also agree that when on a restrictive 'diet' such as the Whole 30, it gets easy to further restrict...that shouldn't be the case, but with all of the self-introspection, trial-and-error figuring out that we do, it's easy to do. I am torn on what to do. In my past, I found myself addicted to caffeine in the form of diet sodas. While I was not chugging them by myself in a hall closet like a drug addict, I did find myself requiring one or two diet cokes in the morning just to feel awake. And then I would need another at lunch to maintain, and then I would need another one after work at 3pm because otherwise I would need a nap. Caffeine-laced diet sodas became my lifeblood. I literally ran on caffeine. My blood type was Caffeine. You get the picture. So if I seem a little wary of drinking something even remotely similar to caffeine, that is the reason. Sure, it sometimes gives me headaches and makes me feel achy in my shoulders and neck, but the addiction that I am referring to is the similarity it has with caffeine, and my past with caffeine. I do plan to partake of this drink in the future, but just need to find a balance. Somewhere between abstaince and binging--that's where I'd like to have a relationship with crio Bru. I am still figuring out exactly how much I want to include the drink in my diet, but I think that's one of the purposes of the Whole 30--to gain awareness and eventually ride our own bikes without the training wheels. Right now I am still trying to figure out why my stomach has been giving me fits over the past few days so until I do I am regretfully abstaining from this drink even though I do love it. After my stomach is feeling back to normal, I'll figure out what to do from there. I think you make a lot of good points and I appreciate your input. Sometimes it's so easy to take things to an extreme and say "I'll never drink that again!" or at least not for the remainder of the Whole 30. I think that kind of extreme behavior (which I admit, I tend to have) might be setting me up for failure. There are some foods that I cannot eat in moderation and I know that about myself. It's far easier for me to have 0 pieces of cake than it is for me to have JUST ONE piece of cake. But, I think in this instance, I might be able to find a happy medium so that I can still drink crio Bru in a healthy way.

[Alisonlcarver]

How are you doing with no nuts and no crio Bru?  (<-- I don't even know what this is.)

Still a work in progress! No nuts or crio Bru yesterday and today, so that's something.

[littleg]

I totally get 0 is easier than 1.  If that is what Crio Bru has to be for you I'm glad you were able to figure that out.  

 

PS - I was a multi LITER a day drinker of Coke Zero for years.  I've been clean for 4 years or so now  

[Alisonlcarver]

Brewer5--you're my FODMAP guru. Do you think taking digestive enzymes would help me, if I do have a FODMAP intolerance? The more I read about this condition, the more it sounds exactly like what I might be dealing with. You may just be a genius.

The fact that it took me roughly 2 1/2 weeks into the Whole 30 to develop symptoms makes sense to me now. I guess it was during this time that my gut bacteria were being fed by the undigested fructose and sugars that I wasn't absorbing, and now I have an overgrowth of bacteria (ew) in my gut. The fact that I have not had problems with these foods in the past doesn't mean that much because now I understand that since I have been consuming these high FODMAP foods in such excess during these past 2 1/2 weeks, of course I would just now be developing symptoms.

Lightbulb.

[Brewer5]

Alison -- I don't think it would hurt anything to try out a digestive enzyme that is Whole 30 compliant.  (I have seen a few threads on this subject.)

 

BUT...  I have taken digestive enzymes for years due to some serious issues I had years ago.  (It also became a mental thing -- feeling like I HAD to have them because I was so afraid of more stomach problems.)  My experience was that it did not matter how many enzymes I took on Whole 30 -- it really did not help with the symptoms caused by FODMAPs.  I had a little relief with broccoli, by chewing some caraway seeds beforehand... but even that had its limits.

 

Happy to say that now I am finally getting myself off the digestive enzymes.  I no longer really need them at all.  I think they should just be a temporary tool to use while you figure some things out.  Too bad it took me over a decade to get to that point.  

[Alisonlcarver]

Alison -- I don't think it would hurt anything to try out a digestive enzyme that is Whole 30 compliant.  (I have seen a few threads on this subject.)

 

BUT...  I have taken digestive enzymes for years due to some serious issues I had years ago.  (It also became a mental thing -- feeling like I HAD to have them because I was so afraid of more stomach problems.)  My experience was that it did not matter how many enzymes I took on Whole 30 -- it really did not help with the symptoms caused by FODMAPs.  I had a little relief with broccoli, by chewing some caraway seeds beforehand... but even that had its limits.

 

Happy to say that now I am finally getting myself off the digestive enzymes.  I no longer really need them at all.  I think they should just be a temporary tool to use while you figure some things out.  Too bad it took me over a decade to get to that point.

Thank you again! Maybe I will hold off on the enzymes then. I think after I eat the remaining fresh and refrigerated foods that contain FODMAPs, I will cut them out and see what happens. I don't want to throw good food away, even if they are on the red FODMAP list! It sounds like it takes a few weeks to see and feel results when cutting out FODMAPs. Was this the experience you had?

[Alisonlcarver]

Day 20 (12/16):

2/3 of the way there!!

I slept about 8 1/2 hours last night and woke up just before my alarm went off at 5:40am! My stomach is feeling better this morning and I am feeling pretty good.

M1: 3 cage-free eggs, 1 tsp. ghee, roasted butternut squash (roasted in coconut oil with salt, pepper, cinnamon, and parsley), 1/2 avocado filled with lemon white balsamic vinegar, herbal tea, at 6am

(Exercise: Run 3 1/2 miles--I was not planning on exercising in the morning but had some downtime at work and decided to knock out half of my workout and save half for later. I am scheduled to run 6 miles today and I know for marathon training I really should be doing the scheduled runs all at once, but today it is just easier to break it up into two mini runs. I didn't eat a pre- or post-WO meal, since this was a last minute thing.)

Mid-morning, around 9-9:30am, my stomach started feeling bloated and not great again. Grr. Maybe it's the avocado and butternut squash? Darn you, FODMAPs! After I eat all of the high FODMAP foods in my fridge, I am going to lay off and see if that helps. I can't bring myself to throw out perfectly good food, even if they are red on the FODMAP list.

M2: (same as yesterday)--about 1 cup of homemade chicken salad, Baggie filled with raw celery, carrots, and grape tomatoes, 1 medium organic Granny Smith apple, at 12pm

Looking at this picture of my lunch, I feel like it looks like a child's lunch. All I need is a crinkled brown paper bag and an Aladdin thermos full of tomato soup and I'm ready to go!

Snack: 2 hard-boiled eggs, 2 cups of crio Bru, at 3-3:30pm (This was originally going to be a pre-WO meal before finishing my second round of 3 miles running, but I decided to run my 3 miles today and do 6 miles tomorrow. Originally I was planning on running 6 miles today and 3 tomorrow, but since I already ran 3 miles this morning, I will just switch the days. That way I can run my 6-mile run tomorrow without interruption. I have also decided that my stomach troubles are not caused by crio Bru and I am drinking it again, but in moderation. If I start to get headaches or achy shoulders I will back off, but I am not omitting it from my diet completely. It's so enjoyable! So there. )

M3: 2 Applegate hot dogs, homemade ketchup, spicy brown mustard, 1 baked sweet potato with 1 tsp. ghee and cinnamon, zucchini sautéed in coconut oil with salt, pepper, and cinnamon, a taste of coconut butter, 1/4 cup full-fat canned coconut cream, at 6:30pm

I have become intrigued by coconut butter since so many people like it, so I tried it tonight. It was all right I guess, but just didn't 'do it for me.' I bought 10 single-serving packets from Amazon.com, so I will use them, but after just one taste I didn't really want more. I, instead, had some coconut cream for an after-dinner treat. I almost had some sunflower nut butter and even put a spoon into the jar, but then thought about my tummy troubles and decided to refrain. Even though I am still eating FODMAPs, there's no point in eating nuts right now just to add insult to injury. I do hope to eat them again in the future because I feel that I can eat them in moderation and I enjoy them very much, especially the pecan/cashew nut butter! Yum! I also have a 10-pack of single serving packets of that, just waiting for me to get over my tummy troubles!

I am also finding that I like to eat a large breakfast and that I don't feel super hungry at dinner time. I start out hungry, sure, but I tend to fill up fast and don't feel the need to eat as much as I do for breakfast and lunch. I have been eating more than I feel that I need to satiate me, just based on the template but I think I am going to start listening to my body more and stop eating when full at dinner, even if I haven't met my quota of food based on the template.

[littleg]

I laughed out loud at your Crio Bru comment.  I sure do hope that it *isn't* one of the foods giving you trouble because you sure do seem to like it  Figuring out which foods are a problem is such a drag... it is so hard to tease things apart.  

[Alisonlcarver]

Ha! Littleg, I knew you would catch that.

You were absolutely right in your post the other day.

And you are right again--it is a drag! But if this self-experimentation helps me discover what foods I should avoid to get rid of my GI troubles, then it'll be totally worth it!

[littleg]

FODMAPs is such a pain.  I spent a good 2-3 months really being careful with them.  At the end of the day I was a bad scientist though and combined low FODMAP with SCD yogurt - so I'll never really know what helped.   I know that if I ever get bad again I will  start with the yogurt though because it is a heck of a lot easier to add that in that take out most of the foods I eat :/  And when I was really bad... I honestly felt relief within minutes of that yogurt.  No idea if it was psychological or what but it worked.  

 

I left a comment card at my local food cooperative about the Crio Bru... no one around here carries it but they might be able to get some.  I'd like to try it!  

[Alisonlcarver]

SCD yogurt--never heard of it. Is this something I can buy at the store?

Man, I wish they sold Crio Bru in the store! They sell a coffee alternative called Teeccino but it's terrible. Just terrible. I order my Crio Bru from their website. It's kindof pricy but I think it's worth it.

[Brewer5]

Thank you again! Maybe I will hold off on the enzymes then. I think after I eat the remaining fresh and refrigerated foods that contain FODMAPs, I will cut them out and see what happens. I don't want to throw good food away, even if they are on the red FODMAP list! It sounds like it takes a few weeks to see and feel results when cutting out FODMAPs. Was this the experience you had?

 

The way I remember it -- I went down to the green list, and within a couple of days I felt completely different.  I had to do this on my 2nd Whole 30 (once I had my own lightbulb moment about FODMAPs) and I remembered it pretty darn fast when I started my 3rd.  I can/could handle some, but the amount and variety I had been trying to do on a Whole 30 was just too much for me.

[thegoldengrahamgirl]

Hey Ali, I meant to say that you should check out the Mega Foods Baby & Me vitamin for a pre-natal.  I think it's compliant.  I get it on iherb (http://www.iherb.com/megafood-baby-me-herb-free-california-blend-pre-post-natal-120-tablets/49338?rcode=dvg342 - use my discount code DVG342 for up to 10% off!).

[littleg]

You have to make the yogurt...  it has to be a 24 hour cook time and it has to use only certain strains for the starter.  The key is the bolded part below - and most yogurts available use bifidus.  I've only found one locally that doesn't (but since it isn't a 24 hour ferment, the concentration of cultures isn't high enough and the lactose isn't low enough so you can't just eat this as a short cut).  But, if you use full fat milk (I get some from a local VT farm) it is amazing delicious, so kind of worth the work  You could also just try getting an SCD compliant probiotic.  

 

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/knowledge_base/detail/scd-yoghurt/

 

The yoghurt you buy can contain Lactobacillus Acidophilus, Streptococcus Thermophilus, and Lactobacillus Bulgaricus. It must not contain Bifidus/Bifidum bacteria.

 

Lots of stuff to think about for what to do next!

 

Oh, I tried Teecino too on the advice of my SIL... blch.  

[jmcbn]

Alison -- I don't think it would hurt anything to try out a digestive enzyme that is Whole 30 compliant.  (I have seen a few threads on this subject.)

 

BUT...  I have taken digestive enzymes for years due to some serious issues I had years ago.  (It also became a mental thing -- feeling like I HAD to have them because I was so afraid of more stomach problems.)  My experience was that it did not matter how many enzymes I took on Whole 30 -- it really did not help with the symptoms caused by FODMAPs.  I had a little relief with broccoli, by chewing some caraway seeds beforehand... but even that had its limits.

 

Happy to say that now I am finally getting myself off the digestive enzymes.  I no longer really need them at all.  I think they should just be a temporary tool to use while you figure some things out.  Too bad it took me over a decade to get to that point.  

This.

I've an almost full jar of DE that I stopped taking a few days after cutting out FODMAPs. I'd been eating Paleo for as long as I can remember, and Whole30 for 5-6mths without any issues with FODMAPs & then I had a period where I was travelling & relying heavily on avocado as my fat source, and eating beets almost every day & that was the end of that. Due to the build up in my system I soon felt full, nauseous, bloated, & looked about 6mths pregnant.

It took a while to sink in during which time I tried the DE - I mean I'd been eating this stuff forever, why would it suddenly start effecting me now? And then Carlacinni made a comment on one of the troubleshooting threads here about FODMAPs making her feel completely stuffed, but not full, & the light bulb went on. I haven't had a DE since, and by cutting out/back on FODMAPs I'm symptom free.

Everyone's mileage varies - I can't eat avocado at all currently, or sweet potatoes. I was never good with cauliflower anyway although now I know why, and I'm avoiding beets because I gave myself a sickener of them and I don't want that bloat & pain to be honest... I can eat cabbage if it's braised slowly with plenty of fat, and I seem to be okay with cooked onion & sauteed mushrooms - again I think the fat used in cooking helps.... I rarely eat fruit. But mostly I eat of the green section of the link that Brewer posted.

Just like the reintro process it's a lot about trial & error I'm afraid.

[SimpleNotEasy]

Super interesting reading here about FODMAPS et al. I guess I'm geeky like that. lol

Alison - way to stay the course & keep figuring out what works for you!

[Alisonlcarver]

Thanks everyone for being so helpful and supportive!  It certainly is a trial and error experiment, and I guess I'm geeky too because I'm actually looking forward to the self-experimentation and figuring out what works for me and what doesn't! 

 

<--Nerd.

[Brewer5]

jmcbn: "gave myself a sickener of them"

I love it.

[Alisonlcarver]

I've an almost full jar of DE that I stopped taking a few days after cutting out FODMAPs. I'd been eating Paleo for as long as I can remember, and Whole30 for 5-6mths without any issues with FODMAPs & then I had a period where I was travelling & relying heavily on avocado as my fat source, and eating beets almost every day & that was the end of that. Due to the build up in my system I soon felt full, nauseous, bloated, & looked about 6mths pregnant.

It took a while to sink in during which time I tried the DE - I mean I'd been eating this stuff forever, why would it suddenly start effecting me now? And then Carlacinni made a comment on one of the troubleshooting threads here about FODMAPs making her feel completely stuffed, but not full, & the light bulb went on. I haven't had a DE since, and by cutting out/back on FODMAPs I'm symptom free.

 

Good info!  That's exactly how I've been feeling--full, bloated (and gassy) but not nauseous thank goodness!

 

I *hate* taking pills of any kind so I don't think the DE sound like anything I want or actually need to try at this point.  Other than the recent GI symptoms, I have been feeling so great eating Whole 30 and living this lifestyle that I don't think I am going to Reintro anything right now (after Day 30).  Instead, I am going to do a self-experiment by cutting out/down on high FODMAP foods and see what happens.  I don't want to officially Reintro anyting off-plan until I figure out this FODMAP thing. 

[Alisonlcarver]

Day 21 (12/17):

Woke up feeling the Tiger Blood!!

M1: 3 cage-free scrambled eggs, 2 tsp. ghee, roasted butternut squash (roasted in coconut oil with salt, pepper, parsley, and cinnamon), 2 pieces of sugar-free bacon, a few cups of crio Bru, at 6am

I loved my breakfast today! So delicious and super filling!

M2: about 1 cup of homemade chicken salad, Baggie filled with celery, carrots, and grape tomatoes, 1 ripe banana, at 11-11:30am

Snack: 1 medium organic Granny Smith apple, 2 T. organic sunflower nut butter, a little more than a closed handful of raw cashews, cup of crio Bru, at 4-4:30pm

I initially thought I was hungry for a snack but it turns out I was having some major cravings! I had to make myself stop eating the nut butter and cashews. Sigh, when will these cravings be under control?! At least it was only two servings of nuts--it could have been worse, I guess. It's so hard to eat well at this time of the year, where there are ALWAYS treats and baked goods in the break room at work. I almost had the thought of eating something off-plan and just restarting my Whole 30 after the holidays since Christmas is coming up. But then, of course, I will feel like crap, lose the control that I've gained, and it just won't be good. Right now though, all I want to do is bake a batch of cookies, eat the dough, and then eat lots of cookies with milk, and other foods that I know will make me feel bad, bloat me, and make me sleep terribly. Why??

[Brewer5]

Alison, do you really want to know why you are struggling with cravings so badly, and when this will end?  Because I know the answer.  

[Alisonlcarver]

Yes.

Let me guess...nuts and fruit.

[thegoldengrahamgirl]

Hey Ali,

 

I think it's the mental toll of depriving ourselves of seasonal treats (part of why Melissa & Dallas caution against doing a Whole30 during the holidays - but now that you've started, I don't think you should stop!).  I think you'll see that I had similar thoughts after our "Santa Claus" party this past Sunday.  Even though we are eating delicious, filling, nutritious and nourishing foods, it CAN be hard mentally to always be "that girl," especially during the holidays.

 

My reintro will definitely involve some paleo baking.  I'll be curious to see if a different nutritional profile vs. traditional baked goods will cause me to feel satisfied with 1-2 cookies.  I plan to consider them as a (poor) fat source with a touch of protein and "sweet" carbs in the context of an overall template meal - not a snack or dessert to be eaten separately.

 

But remember, one off-plan choice (not that you will do this, but in the future world, you will) or even one binge does not mean that you've completely lost control!

[ShannonM816]

Day 21 (12/17):

Woke up feeling the Tiger Blood!!

M1: 3 cage-free scrambled eggs, 2 tsp. ghee, roasted butternut squash (roasted in coconut oil with salt, pepper, parsley, and cinnamon), 2 pieces of sugar-free bacon, a few cups of crio Bru, at 6am

I loved my breakfast today! So delicious and super filling!

image.jpeg

M2: about 1 cup of homemade chicken salad, Baggie filled with celery, carrots, and grape tomatoes, 1 ripe banana, at 11-11:30am

Snack: 1 medium organic Granny Smith apple, 2 T. organic sunflower nut butter, a little more than a closed handful of raw cashews, cup of crio Bru, at 4-4:30pm

I initially thought I was hungry for a snack but it turns out I was having some major cravings! I had to make myself stop eating the nut butter and cashews. Sigh, when will these cravings be under control?! At least it was only two servings of nuts--it could have been worse, I guess. It's so hard to eat well at this time of the year, where there are ALWAYS treats and baked goods in the break room at work. I almost had the thought of eating something off-plan and just restarting my Whole 30 after the holidays since Christmas is coming up. But then, of course, I will feel like crap, lose the control that I've gained, and it just won't be good. Right now though, all I want to do is bake a batch of cookies, eat the dough, and then eat lots of cookies with milk, and other foods that I know will make me feel bad, bloat me, and make me sleep terribly. Why??

 

Breakfast at 6 am, lunch 5 hours later at 11 -- that's perfect. Then, five hours later you're hungry again -- great! That's what you're supposed to be feeling -- occasionally people do get to where they can go longer than that, but 4-5 hours between meals is what Whole30 recommends. So since it's normal to be hungry then, just plan for it -- instead of your apple and nut butter, plan for that 4 pm snack with a mini meal of protein, fat, and vegetables. More chicken salad, or hard boiled eggs, or leftovers, or make up a frittata/egg casserole type thing and bring a big hunk of that to eat in the afternoon, maybe with some guacamole or olives.