Sugar Dragon Slayers

[littleg]

I decided to re-read the Taubes book.  I forgot how much the first few chapters make so much sense about how WRONG convention wisdom is about the interplay between calories in/out, weight loss and exercise.  My husband starts his marathon training in a week.  He is one of 4 brothers 2 of whom have run BQ times.  So OF COURSE now he needs to do one too  But he is also doing the training to lose weight.  I'm curious to see how his n=1 study works out.  He is getting old like me so he doesn't have the 20-something male metabolism thing on his side anymore... we shall see.

 

And Brewer... did you say you made MCT mayo?  What was the other oil you used?  I got a jar  I'm having 1 tbsp and coconut milk in some coffee this AM.  If I don't ruin the pair of pants I'm wearing I'll try making the mayo.

[SimpleNotEasy]

Thought I'd get y'all's input on today's meals.

Here is breakfast. I had a full cup of coffee with coconut milk (full fat, canned) earlier. Broccoli was roasted in coconut oil - leftover from last night. This is about 2 eggs. I usually have 3, but there were 10 eggs left for me & the 3 boys this morning.

Laura - I perused Why We Get Fat again over the weekend... I totally agree with you. We've just had it wrong for such a long time.

[Alisonlcarver]

Laura--I loved the book!  I don't want to return it to the library!  I loved how he spent 85% of the book dispelling diet myths before he gave his suggestions.  The science is solid and it makes his diet argument that much stronger.  Congrats to your husband for the marathon training!--will you be joining him?  (or perhaps at the finish line )

 

My next book will be "Salt Sugar Fat"...starting that tonight.  I bet I'm going to be SUPER pissed off!  Haha!

 

Sara--breakfast looks great!  Yummy yummy!  Remind me again, are you going LCHF now?  How are the cravings--any better?  It's amazing what a little bit of time will do.  Those INTENSE cravings I had on Sunday evening turned into so-so cravings last night (MUCH easier to resist) and although I could have had some fruit I refrained from fruit and nuts yesterday.  I imagine today will be even better.  Those intense cravings last (but get better over time) for a couple of days for me.  I hope yours are better! 

 

Ya'll, I am not able to post pictures anymore.  I don't know why.  I would like to start posting them again, since I'll be posting my Keto Whole 30 log in the Whole 30 forum...not sure what I am doing wrong.  I have been trying to upload them directly to my iPad.  Maybe I need to use my computer instead?

[Brewer5]

Alison, I upload photos to photobucket, click on the "IMG" link to share -- it copies, and then I paste that link directly into my messages.  They also show up nice and big that way, so no one needs to click on them.  It's a few steps, but it works for me.

[Brewer5]

And Brewer... did you say you made MCT mayo?  What was the other oil you used?  I got a jar  I'm having 1 tbsp and coconut milk in some coffee this AM.  If I don't ruin the pair of pants I'm wearing I'll try making the mayo.

 

Yes, I use the NOW brand of MCT ~ and I do not usually need my brown pants.      

 

It's like a super concentrated coconut oil, though, you know ~ which has a cleansing, healing, detoxifying effect.  So, some folks really need to ease into it.

 

The best consistency we've gotten for mayo has been a mix of about 1/2 - 3/4 MCT and 1/2 Trader Joe's light olive.  I also use the avocado oil from Costco sometimes, but it does turn out a little more runny for some reason.  For a long time now, we have all used it with at least 1/2 MCT, and no problems.  THAT particular batch I had used ALL MCT... and for as much mayo as I consumed that day, that may have been a bit much.

[Brewer5]

image.jpg

Thought I'd get y'all's input on today's meals.

Here is breakfast. I had a full cup of coffee with coconut milk (full fat, canned) earlier. Broccoli was roasted in coconut oil - leftover from last night. This is about 2 eggs. I usually have 3, but there were 10 eggs left for me & the 3 boys this morning.

Laura - I perused Why We Get Fat again over the weekend... I totally agree with you. We've just had it wrong for such a long time.

 

Sara ~ I think the important questions are:

 

Does this keep you satiated for a reasonable amount of time (at least a few hours, hopefully more?)

 

Do you feel good & energetic, clear-headed all morning?  (You should.)

 

When it is time to eat lunch ~ do you get funky, or is it more "hmmm, I should eat soon"?

 

How does the rest of your day go?

 

Do you get snacky in the evening, like you are looking through the cabinets for... oh, I dunno, NUTS?  

 

It may sound cliche but I've found that breakfast really IS the most important meal of the day.  It sets the stage for everything else.  If we pay attention, there's a pattern.  Can I go longer without breakfast, or just eat a little something?  Of course I can.  I could go all day now, if I needed to.  Does it ever do anything great for me to eat less or push it back until later?  NO.  It always seems to catch up with me ~ so in the evening, I need to eat a lot more food to get that "done" signal.

 

Your breakfast looks good to me.  Really awesome, in fact.  But how the rest of your day plays out is really the key to knowing if you need to maybe add more breakfast tomorrow.

 

On the subject of eggs:  We rely on them heavily here.  If we get down to the last dozen, a panic starts to set in for me and my husband.  LOL  We want our own chickens -- umm, badly.

 

But for now, we buy our eggs from a local lady who has a farm.  She lives about 20-25 minutes away -- so when we buy them from her, we stock up!  Yesterday we bought 20 dozen.  $2.50/dozen x 20 = $50.00 on eggs.  I know, this is a good deal, because it is better than we can find regular store eggs for (which we've had to buy lately, with the holidays etc, we just hadn't made the trip out there for awhile).  240 eggs will last our family of five...  I don't know, MAYBE a month?

[littleg]

 

It's like a super concentrated coconut oil, though, you know ~ which has a cleansing, healing, detoxifying effect.  So, some folks really need to ease into it.

 

The best consistency we've gotten for mayo has been a mix of about 1/2 - 3/4 MCT and 1/2 Trader Joe's light olive.  I also use the avocado oil from Costco sometimes, but it does turn out a little more runny for some reason.  

 

Have you heard of Seth Roberts?  He passed away but he was a big self experimenter.  He "invented" something he called the Shangri La Diet.  You have to consume either pure fat 2 hours from other food to get this magical appetite suppressant.  It had to be tasteless.  I had nose plugs in my car, kitchen drawer, etc while trying this... Anyway,  some people had some crazy good luck with it per his forums.  One day I did my shot of coconut oil (2 tbsp) and I honestly thought I was going to poop out my actual intestines.  I have NEVER had an experience like that. It was bad.  I felt like I had been punched in the abdomen for a few days I was so sore.  

 

Per avocado oil mayo - it is always less firm than the light olive oil version.  I wish I could thicken up my avocado mayo a little.  I don't want to use the light olive oil.  How does the MCT do in terms of thickness - does it make the avo mayo even worse?

[littleg]

On the topic of the importance of breakfast... Have you found that the timing is as important as W30 says?  What about liquid fat in the AM?  My 12 hour shift days still make it hard for me to eat at 6 AM because I just don't like to.  The last week or so I've been having more coconut milk coffee - probably 1/3 c full fat coconut milk - so 250ish fat calories.  This morning I had 1 tbsp of MCT oil in addition.  Its 11 AM, I walked the dog for ~4.5 miles and I could eat, but I'm not starving.  At work the last few days I've been eating "breakfast" around 9:30-10 and finding I'm ok when I get home at 8 PM - no binge urges (which were guaranteed if I went 4-5 hrs between waking and eating).  

 

Still learning what WholeLittleg forevs is gonna look like

[whole30determined]

Yes, you are in the right place.  My friends here helped me off of a ledge last night.  The lessons learned and mindfulness gained during the Whole 30 are HUGE here too.  I have so much more mindfulness about what I am eating now compared to where I was just 46 days ago.  I was sugar-binging 3-4 days a week before my December Whole 30.  And I've done two Whole 30's in the past, successfully. That sugar dragon works slowly--it has patience and will wear you down over time.  It's a gradual process but once the dragon is let back in, it can TAKE OVER.  I am so thankful for the lessons I learned during this past Whole 30.  It really has been a nutritional reset for me.  I never want to go back to where I was.  It is a vicious cycle with the sugar dragon.  You crave sugar, you eat sugar, you feel bad about yourself, you get discouraged, you have the 'what the hell' mentality so you binge...on sugar.    And around and around it goes.  I am so glad you are here with us.  It's great that there is a group of us here for each other because usually there is one person who needs help while the others are thriving.  (Last night was my turn to need help--and lots of it!)  Without the Whole 30 and without this group (both for help but also for accountability), last night would have gone a lot differently.  So thankful!! 

 

I LOVE your attitude!  I am not a person who easily gets mad or upset, but I love getting riled up about subjects related to nutrition.  It fuels my fire.  It’s motivating. One of the things I say all the time when I read a good part of a nutrition book or watch a significant part of a diet movie is that I get so pissed off!  USE THAT FIRE!  Use your anger!  Get mad at sugar and carbs!  You have done nothing wrong!  Yes, we have to hold ourselves accountable for the foods we put into our mouths.  But certain foods are engineered (literally, in a lab.  Ew.) to make us crave them, want them, purchase them even though we know they are bad for us, think/fantasize about them, and fight ourselves over their consumption…And after you watch “That sugar film” you will be even more pissed off at sugar. I can’t wait to hear what you think of it.  “That sugar film” was a suggestion from Brewer for our group, and I can’t thank her enough for the suggestion.  Brewer is our nutrition guru, our leader of sorts.  Haha, don’t let your head get too big now, Brewer.

 

 

We're about to get religious in this forum, because I second that AMEN!

 

Haha, you guys knew I was a total nerd, right?

I finally figured out to reply to a comment!!   Woo hoo!   Ok, so that move, That Sugar Film, holy smokes, was awesome!  In a good and a bad way, it was so good.  I got out my notes and took so many notes as they explained everything about sugar.  And boy, now it made me madder than ever...but it also helped me to realize that it was developed to make us want more and more of it and to crave it.  Now I just want to say, "in your face!" and send a message to the sugar industry that some of us aren't falling for their tricks or their sugary products any more.   So thank you for that!

 

Sounds like I'm in the right place, then, and I hope that I can also help encourage others on this site as we all struggle with the battle to fight this urge/craving for sugar.   Excited to start this journey with you all and more importantly, to be accountable and stay true and honest to myself and to others.  

[Brewer5]

 I honestly thought I was going to poop out my actual intestines. 

 

Per avocado oil mayo - it is always less firm than the light olive oil version.  I wish I could thicken up my avocado mayo a little.  I don't want to use the light olive oil.  How does the MCT do in terms of thickness - does it make the avo mayo even worse?

 

Ok, first of all, this is horrible.  But did make me actually LOL.  We can laugh about it after the fact, right?  But in the moment, it's one of the most awful feelings in the world.

 

The MCT is what thickens the mayo for me.  I do not enjoy a runnier mayo.  I have used part melted coconut oil -- and it was good -- but it then also melted when you would put it on a burger or something.  The MCT really holds a nice mayo consistency -- better than anything else I have ever tried.

[Brewer5]

On the topic of the importance of breakfast... Have you found that the timing is as important as W30 says?  What about liquid fat in the AM?  My 12 hour shift days still make it hard for me to eat at 6 AM because I just don't like to.  The last week or so I've been having more coconut milk coffee - probably 1/3 c full fat coconut milk - so 250ish fat calories.  This morning I had 1 tbsp of MCT oil in addition.  Its 11 AM, I walked the dog for ~4.5 miles and I could eat, but I'm not starving.  At work the last few days I've been eating "breakfast" around 9:30-10 and finding I'm ok when I get home at 8 PM - no binge urges (which were guaranteed if I went 4-5 hrs between waking and eating).  

 

Still learning what WholeLittleg forevs is gonna look like

 

I really think this just comes down to self-experimentation.  We should do what works!  Do I think everyone needs to eat within an hour of waking, all the time, forever?  No.  I don't.  I think it is an excellent rule for Whole 30 -- because most people coming to this program need a complete reset and have no clue how to interpret their body's signals, which are often completely out of whack.

 

There are some days where I get busy doing other things, and I am simply not hungry for breakfast right away.  There are some days when I wake up and think, "Man, I need a big breakfast today."  I don't feel bad or anything...  I can just sense it.  And I EAT.  

 

Yesterday was one of those days -- I ate almond-stuffed green olives AND an ounce of raw macadamia nuts, while I was cooking my usual egg, egg yolks, kale, crap ton of coconut oil and duck fat combo.  

 

Today, I walked on the treadmill for awhile and sipped my coffee before I even thought about making breakfast.

 

I think once you've figured out your body pretty well, there is no need to follow anyone else's rules.  Whatever you figure out works for you, your life, your schedule, your body -- that's what you gotta do.  No feelings of wanting to binge sounds like a big WIN to me.  Congrats.  

[SimpleNotEasy]

Lunch - this is earlier than I am typically hungry for lunch. Probably bc I usually eat another egg. But I'm not hangry- just ready for lunch.

It's curry made with full fat coconut milk, broccoli, sugar snap peas, & red bell pepper on a bed of cauliflower rice. Leftover baked chicken breast on top - roughly a palm sized serving. A quarter of a large avocado on the side. Not beautiful, but it will still taste good. I squeezed a little lime juice on top & salted it.

My guess is that this meal will take me to 6 pm, but I'll evaluate how I feel this afternoon.

Ali - I've decided to do an 8-week LCHF experiment. I'm going to aim for ketosis, but won't be buying any tracking devices. I may enter some data into MFP to reorient myself into the lower carb world. Some people (who don't aim for ketosis) think that less than 100g carbs a day is low carb. It is lowER than the SAD, but I don't think it's low enough for me.

[Alisonlcarver]

Since you ladies are talking about making mayo with other oils besides light-tasting olive oil, what is the reason for this?  Health or taste?  I have been using strictly light-tasting olive oil when I make mayonnaise...and I know I'll be making a LOT more shortly!

[Alisonlcarver]

I honestly thought I was going to poop out my actual intestines

 

First of all, that's awful.

 

Second of all, I'm glad I'm not the only one that actually laughed out loud at that comment.  I'm still giggling.

[Brewer5]

Alison, for one thing, I don't trust most olive oils ~ you do NOT always get what you think you are paying for.  There is an entire book about this:

 

Extra Virginity: The Sublime and Scandalous World of Olive Oil

 

http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/0393343618?keywords=virgin%20olive%20oil%20book&qid=1452625400&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1

 

Second ~ MCT does have some great benefits.  Check it out:

 

http://www.vitacost.com/now-foods-sports-mct-oil-32-fl-oz

 

My guess is, that when you really start looking into fueling runs in a ketogenic state -- you will see MCT mentioned a lot.

[littleg]

Grumble. Trying to post on my phone and my last post got eaten...

Shorter version. I'm not sure I trust light olive oil. Given the quantities of mayo that I'm eating I would rather have a slightly less thick product but feel better about the oil I'm ingesting. Thus avocado oil.

[Alisonlcarver]

It may sound cliche but I've found that breakfast really IS the most important meal of the day.  It sets the stage for everything else.  If we pay attention, there's a pattern.  Can I go longer without breakfast, or just eat a little something?  Of course I can.  I could go all day now, if I needed to.  Does it ever do anything great for me to eat less or push it back until later?  NO.  It always seems to catch up with me ~ so in the evening, I need to eat a lot more food to get that "done" signal.

 

I totally agree about that importance of M1!  When I skimp on M1 I am playing catch up for the rest of the day.  I get hungry for lunch earlier, I want to snack, I have more cravings.  I have actually started eating a little past satiety on M1 and that seems to work well for me.  I'll start listening to my M1 satiety signals (meaning stopping eating when my body says to stop) when I start eating LCHF though, to see if the extra fat and decreased carbs/glucose load helps promote prolonged satiety.

[Alisonlcarver]

Brewer and Laura--thanks!  I have so much to learn!

[Alisonlcarver]

I have a co-worker who is doing the Whole 30.  She started on January 4.  She has done one Whole 30 in the past after asking why I eat the way I eat and after I told her about the Whole 30.  She lost about 15-20 pounds eating Whole 30 in 30 days, but then proceeded to put the weight back on over the holidays.  She is a binger, and has an all-or-nothing mentality (I'm either going to do the perfect diet or I'm doing nothing at all.)  She has done Paleo and Crossfit in the past.  She could probably lose about 40-50 pounds total.  She has read ISWF and understands the concepts.  But she tries to cheat the system.  Earlier today she told me that she is doing the Whole 30 about 90% of the time.  She texted me the other day asking me if she could eat pork rinds because they don't contain any off-plan ingredients.  (I laughed and told her NO!)  We were out to eat at dinner together on Friday night and I asked the waiter all of the appropriate Whole 30 questions but totally forgot to ask about sugar in the dressing.  I'm not doing a strict Whole 30, so I ate the dressing anyway.  She was the one who actually brought it up, that it might contain sugar.  I said, oh no I bet it does, I hadn't even thought of that!  She proceeded to eat the dressing anyway, and still claims to be a week into her Whole 30 now.  I don't know how to help this woman, but with her trying to cheat the system by eating pork rinds, fruits, nuts (yea yea I know, I have done that too), I just KNOW that she is not getting it.  She is eating the foods (well, at least 90% of the time), but she is not changing her relationship with the foods.  She is not growing psychologically.  She looks at this as a 30-day reset, and I KNOW she will go back to her old eating habits just like she did in the fall. 

 

I want to help this woman, but don't know how to do so without sounding judgmental and all high-and-mighty, know-it-all.  Suggestions??

[Brewer5]

Distance.

 

Is that possible?

 

You cannot help people who do not want to help themselves.  Fact.

 

And you were probably right, telling her no about the pork rinds -- but the fact is that while they can be a snacking nightmare, the official word on the forum is that if they are just pork (which all the plain ones I've ever seen are) -- they ARE compliant.  I have read all of the discussions, and they have reluctantly received the "technically ok" pass for something like a meatball recipe...  just not for snacking on.

 

I'll be quite honest -- I'd rather see someone munching on pork rinds in their "emergency-stuck-in-traffic-for-5-hours" situation than Larabars -- any day.

[whole30determined]

Ok - so I met with the nutritionist I work with today. She helps me with mindset stuff. I thought I would share three things that she asked me to journal about. 

 

1. What are the "musts" for me to continue in my "new lifestyle"? 

 

2. What are the yellow light signs for me that tell me to slow down when I'm heading off track?

 

3. What are the red light signs that tell me to STOP and move away from whatever I'm about to do that may cause me to really have trouble getting back to my new lifestyle?

 

Gosh, this is so good SImpleNotEasy!!   I just did this for myself and I put it in my phone so I can always have this handy.  I know exactly what my triggers are and now that I have my food log, it's always obvious when I start down that slippery-slope of adding those "small" sugars that end up turning into a full-out binge 2-3 weeks later.  It starts SO small, and then it just goes downhill.   Thank you for posting this!   I'd love to hear if anyone else did this exercise too, just to hear what others get them off track.  

[SimpleNotEasy]

Whole30determined - so glad it helped you! I haven't sat down with my journal yet, but I plan to share once I write.

Found myself a little hungry & kind of snacky, so had some decaf w coconut milk.

[thegoldengrahamgirl]

Ali, (I also posted this in Brewer's thread; just wanted to be sure you saw it!): be prepared to eat what might feel like an uncomfortable and/or "unhealthy" amount of fat to get keto-adapted.  I'm serious.  It's a next-level step in nutrition re: everything you thought you knew was wrong.

 

I think I'm going to order some NOW MCT oil in my next iHerb shipment.  I'm pretty happy with most of their products.  Back when I was doing whey protein, I considered them to have one of the "cleaner" options.  Currently, I'm using their magnesium citrate as my mag supplement.

 

Today's a big day: CHEESE reintro (mainly because of the lasagna dinner at my neighbours - we'll see how THAT goes.  I'm trying to eat just a few bites to be polite and avoid the noodles at all costs.  Don't want to muddy the waters of cheese reintro with gluten).

 

Breakfast: 2 eggs, 2 strips of crispy compliant bacon, 2 cups raw spinach wilted down in the bacon fat and 1 oz. of cheddar cheese.  Delicious!  I'll do a mozzarella cheese string pre-workout.  Brewer, I see how easily I could fall in the trap of "convenient protein."  But cheese goes back out again tomorrow as I go back to Whole30-compliant to prepare for the next reintro.

 

I've deliberately set today up with <30g total carbs (because I'm on that path anyway) but also for some "wiggle room" in case dinner is a fiasco.  I hope not.  I'm well-prepared.

[Alisonlcarver]

Ali, (I also posted this in Brewer's thread; just wanted to be sure you saw it!): be prepared to eat what might feel like an uncomfortable and/or "unhealthy" amount of fat to get keto-adapted.  I'm serious.  It's a next-level step in nutrition re: everything you thought you knew was wrong.

 

I think I'm going to order some NOW MCT oil in my next iHerb shipment.  I'm pretty happy with most of their products.  Back when I was doing whey protein, I considered them to have one of the "cleaner" options.  Currently, I'm using their magnesium citrate as my mag supplement.

 

Today's a big day: CHEESE reintro (mainly because of the lasagna dinner at my neighbours - we'll see how THAT goes.  I'm trying to eat just a few bites to be polite and avoid the noodles at all costs.  Don't want to muddy the waters of cheese reintro with gluten).

 

Thanks Lauren.  How long has it taken you to get used to eating so much fat, or are you used to it yet?  I want to order some MCT oil now too.  What do you plan to do with it?

 

Brewer and Laura, by adding MCT oil and ghee to your coffees, it this considered 'bulletproof coffee?'  If you are adding oils and fats to your coffees, is this considered your M1?  I could definitely get into having a cup of Crio Bru with oil and ghee as M1 and seeing how long that tides me over.  Sure beats making a Whole 30 compliant breakfast every morning.  I like the idea of drinking this while walking on the treadmill--great idea, Brewer!  I am still on the fence regarding what to do abut Crio Bru--no surprise there.

 

Lauren, good luck on the rest of your cheese reintro day!  I hope it goes better for you than it went for me!  I had some cheese on my salad, some creamy salad dressing, and one slice of pizza on Saturday night.  I got one zit on Sunday and woke up with another zit this morning.  I KNOW it's from the dairy.  I know that dairy equals face breakouts and that gluten/grains equals cravings and blood sugar fluctuations.  Two entire food groups to avoid!

 

P.S.--Lauren, I loved your video about the fire beef!  I've never seen meat cooked with a blow torch and cut up using scissors!  Ha! 

[ArtFossil]

 

Ya'll, I am not able to post pictures anymore.  I don't know why.  I would like to start posting them again, since I'll be posting my Keto Whole 30 log in the Whole 30 forum...not sure what I am doing wrong.  I have been trying to upload them directly to my iPad.  Maybe I need to use my computer instead?

Alison, your iPad will do just fine. Just make sure the photo is in your Photos app and you can select it as part of the add attachment prompt.